[Fiend]

Once again plundering and pillaging the UKB collective knowledge organ...

I've got a week or so to go abroad in early April and am inspired by the above destinations. I need a bit of advice on them to make a choice, particularly concerning weather and logistics. In particular I'd like to know which has the most reliable climate to get plenty of climbing done! Also...

Pfalz - has a guidebook available which is good, seems to allow some chalk and metal gear - is weather good tho??

Elbsandstein - looks very inspiring but not sure about chalk ban - does this apply across the whole region??

Annot - had a look for guides before and couldn't find any. Looks cool but could be quite hot already??

Cheers in advance.

P.S. Will be looking for partners too no doubt

[i.munro]

I was in Annot April last year & it certainly wasn't too warm or even close . It was however frustratingly unsettled.
I think this was exceptional weather though as we were able to climb comfortably at La Turbie (a contender for the warmest crag in France award )when the rain eventually forced a retreat to the coast.   

[Serpico]

Annot - had a look for guides before and couldn't find any. Looks cool but could be quite hot already??

Have you seen the website?
Annot is quite high up and can get snow at this time of year. I've climbed there in April and it was fine. The further up the hill you go, the better the rock is, and when I was last there they were still uncovering new areas. It's an awesome area with a cool little campsite, I'm just waiting for the day when the Euro-roadtripping-soap-dodging-shit-at-the-crag crowd finally discover it, best to visit now before it's too late.

we were able to climb comfortably at La Turbie (a contender for the warmest crag in France award )

I think that award should go to the nearby south facing Castillion - if the sun's out out it's too hot, no matter what time of year. Access at La Turbie is currently restricted to a lot of sectors as they're carrying out stabilisation/vandalism.

[jwi]

Elbsandstein - looks very inspiring but not sure about chalk ban - does this apply across the whole region??

Most definitely no chalk on the Saxon (German) side of the border.  In Elbtal on the Bohemian (Czech) side chalk is allowed on routes, but only if they are harder than french 6c and was put up after 1990 http://www.geoquest-verlag.de/?q=en/node/287

I have no personal experience to draw from but on http://www.on-sight.de/gebiete/index.html?sachs_ge.html they say that the best time is from beginning of May to October, and that late summer / autumn is the best time.

I think you should go if you have the chance.  I've only climbed there 2 days, but I'll go there again.  It is one of the best areas I've been to.

[Fiend]

Thanks for the advice so far...

Serpico, I'd be planning on doing ROUTES in Annot so I couldn't get much useful information from the bouldering site :S. If there is a route guide I'd love to know!

I've heard people saying it was pretty warm there even over winter, but if not, it could be a good contender.


To be honest I am going off the Elbesandstein idea....as awesome as the towers look I think logistics / rules sound too frustrating for me...

[Serpico]

Serpico, I'd be planning on doing ROUTES in Annot

Freak.

I've heard different things about the routes in Annot, but mostly that they're heavily chipped.
I'm pretty sure Ru's been, PM him.

[i.munro]

Not the best source of info as all I've done is looked up at the routes near Annot station while bouldering but in the absence of other replies.

The hard stuff seemed to be lines of pockets up blank walls (rumour was that some/many of the pockets are drilled).
The easier stuff looked natural (from the ground ??) There's a climbing shop within 200m ( 'le degaine' from memory)  so I assume they will have a guide.

[grimer]

To be honest I am going off the Elbesandstein idea....as awesome as the towers look I think logistics / rules sound too frustrating for me...

It is a fantastic climbing area but just don't expect to do much climbing. I gave my opinions on a thread in response to Tom de gay on here somewhere but i think he had a great time.

[Palomides]

I'd be planning on doing ROUTES in Annot so I couldn't get much useful information from the bouldering site :S. If there is a route guide I'd love to know!

I haven't been, but I seem to remember that there are two kinds of routes at Annot - the sports routes (which have the reputation of being a bit hacked about, esp the harder ones) and there's also a bit of a niche trad scene there.

Googling for "Annot trad" comes up with this blog:
http://tradannot.over-blog.com/

and a vid:


I'm pretty sure that one of the guys from the blog has posted over on UKC, and I think that Enty who posts over there has done some trad stuff down there too.

Is that vague enough?

[Fiend]

That is vague enough .

I have seen some really good photos of Annot stuff....can't remember who from. Might be Wide Boy Senior? I heard good things about it too. Will have to do more research.

G-dawg, that's what I figured about Elbe. I think the area looks magical and intriguing but maybe needs a more specialist approach. Ideally I'd go with someone who has been before....

I've ordered the Pfalz guide, will see what that brings up.

[metal arms]

http://jeffmercier.blogspot.com/2011/08/trad-climb-annot.html

Annot looks really good.  Lots of pics of fun looking cracklines on the link.

[duncan]

Annot looks like fun.

Tradannot blog

Double ropes might come in handy.

[Fiend]

I've got a couple of long extenders, no problems

[Palomides]

Can you change to late April???

[Fiend]

Possibly re-scheduling anyway.... A flyer that high quality is irresistable!

[Fiend]

Anyone know how far the Pfalz climbing season extends into Autumn. Haven't got out there and am still super-keen if I can get away in October...

[Muenchener]

Anyone know how far the Pfalz climbing season extends into Autumn. Haven't got out there and am still super-keen if I can get away in October...

Pfalz don't know. If it's similar to Frankenjura, I was there early Nov last year and south facing crags were fine as long as you had a long enough lie-in to allow the morning mist to clear. Arriving at the crag before 11 was futile.

[Fiend]

Cheers that's useful. What is the climate / rainfall likely to be in October??

[Paul B]

Anyone know how far the Pfalz climbing season extends into Autumn. Haven't got out there and am still super-keen if I can get away in October...

Pfalz don't know. If it's similar to Frankenjura, I was there early Nov last year and south facing crags were fine as long as you had a long enough lie-in to allow the morning mist to clear. Arriving at the crag before 11 was futile.

I'm not sure it is similar to the jura, when I drove from one (jura) to the other it was a lot warmer in the Pfalz. Records make it look as if Oct is one of the driest months (the main concern for sandstone)  but temperatures look fairly low and some of the better crags were surrounded by woodland.

[Muenchener]

What is the climate / rainfall likely to be in October??

Cold & wet in Bavaria right now. My experience is that there's often a settled dry spell in late Oct - early Nov.

wetteronline.de gives pretty reliable six day forecasts. Entering the name of a town near the climbing area of your choice gives a three day forecast, clicking on "trend" gives another three days.

[T_B]

Thread resurrection.

Thinking about going to Annot in August as part of a family Euro road trip. Is it the sort of place with a mini 'scene' where I may be able to hook up with folks to do routes? I've read the mixed reports about the (sport) routes, but would take a rack if I thought I would get some t-rad in.

Any other knowledge from anyone who's been much appreciated.

Mrs T_B has been before and is keen to return as it's a beautiful area, apparently.

[Paul B]

The guy that owns the bar (Lou Cafetié) nearest the pizza van in the Verdon (Pat) is very keen on Annot. I declined the offer to go along but he's shown a friend (can give you details if that's useful) around this area and was always keen to show it off, perhaps send a message through Facebook?

I didn't get the impression there was a large scene to tap into but I could be mistaken.

[T_B]

OK, thanks Paul. Not on FB but know someone who lives in La Palud, so maybe he'll know him?

[Paul B]

It's hardly a big place so I'd expect so!

[Fultonius]

What's the lowdown on Pfalz Matt?

We're driving right past next weekend and considering an afternoon / morning quick hit. Probably arrive Friday pm, camp, climb saturday Morning then head onwards towards Slovenia.

Looking for well bolted sport, easy to find, topo, near camping / not too far off route.

[Fiend]

What's the lowdown on Pfalz Matt?

It's bloody amazing. Better for partly bolted Churnet-style adventures than Siurana-style mundane ticking. The routes are quite bouldery or quite reassuringly traditional or sometimes both. The crags are all short drives from the town of Dahn and mostly short walk-ins. There is a hefty guidebook and the Bärenbrunnerhof may have topos.

[MischaHY]

What's the lowdown on Pfalz Matt?

We're driving right past next weekend and considering an afternoon / morning quick hit. Probably arrive Friday pm, camp, climb saturday Morning then head onwards towards Slovenia.

Looking for well bolted sport, easy to find, topo, near camping / not too far off route.

I'm close to Pfalz and have spent lots of time there so can happily give more detailed information and pictures from the guidebook if you like. Be aware that many routes will require some trad placements, especially UIAA 7+ or below. The climbing, rock and setting is incredible and worth a trip in itself.

[Fultonius]

It would be preferable to not take trad gear if we could - are there any fully bolted crags? I guess we could sling a few cams in if we have to.

[Paul B]

Yes there are and they're good. I'll have a look at my archives but Magnetfingers is a route (arete) that sticks in my mind also The Big Easy at another venue.

The local shop lent us a full double rack of cams in ~2008 and only took a mobile number as we were walking out of the door.

[MischaHY]

It would be preferable to not take trad gear if we could - are there any fully bolted crags? I guess we could sling a few cams in if we have to.

Oh yeah tons but just depends if you want easier stuff - under 6c is a little harder to find consistently. As long as you're operating 7a or above then it's grand. As Paul points out Magnetfinger is the ultra classic 7c+. Windjammer is a really nice 8a+ with other bolted routes on the crag. Here is the local database: https://tourendatenbank.xoxs.de/pfalztour/dbframeset.htm

[Fultonius]

We're going to be there tomorrow, it's going to be warm and sunny with not much wind so it would be ideal to go to a crag that's shady, got some low 6s that are either well protected or bolted (oh doesn't lead trad, but happy enough to pinkpoint on my gear if its well protected). Don't need a huge range, just 3 or 4 routes. Doubt I'll be trying anything hard in the sun! Any ideas?

[SA Chris]

MAAARGRET!

[Paul B]

We're going to be there tomorrow, it's going to be warm and sunny with not much wind so it would be ideal to go to a crag that's shady, got some low 6s that are either well protected or bolted (oh doesn't lead trad, but happy enough to pinkpoint on my gear if its well protected). Don't need a huge range, just 3 or 4 routes. Doubt I'll be trying anything hard in the sun! Any ideas?

What about Honigfelsen?
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/honigfelsen-19425/#overview

This was the crag I mentioned with Magnet Fingers:
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/burghaldefels-14613/#overview

I remember it being the best I went to (this was 2008 though). Actually, the more I look back at the guidebook I think this would be suitable. Although the harder things are steeper, there are some easier slabby things and I remember them being the kind with sharp plated crimps rather than really technical and smeary.

This was the other (featuring the Big Easy).
https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/retschelfelsen-28497/

From memory you passed through the crag to the shady side although it was all quite steep.

It was also boiling when we were there.