[Nibile]

it's good to have positive news.
anyway, I agree with DOylo. Rich called for trouble and got it. strange guy indeed: if I had climbed those routes, I'd tattoo myself "I climb 9a" on my forehaead, and would fit the subject into any conversation.
"hey have you heard Mark's new car broke down?"
"oh yes, by the way, the day I climbed Action Direct all the cars in the parking seemed fine".

[SA Chris]

Either the guy is credible or he isn't. Thankfully there is a very easy way for him to prove if he is, absolutely and without a shred of doubt.

Brain exam? Mind meld?

Lie detector or torture I think.

[Ru]

This chap says he has the videos of Rich doing Careless and Liquid Ambar.

Dan said this to you?

[Bonjoy]

I'll PM you Ru. Suffice to say he said it. If you disagree after reading the PM then by all means post something to that effect.

[Jim]

one thing that is clear is that rich was a monster as seen in doyles vid of him doing pinky perky in the school.
He clearly was capable of doing these routes/problems but wether he did them I remain unconvinced for various reasons including promised vid of careless, belayer on zone, 4 minute mile, marathon irregularities etc...
If he did do them then its a great shame as IMO it would be something to be very proud of, I believe he had it on his number plate on his car?
why not just release the vids etc...
Maybe its something to do with the whole heason scandle.
Its good to see that ben is cranking fairly hard and putting a few vids up, would be great if rich did the same and proved that he is not a liar as he obviously has put a lot of time and effort into climbing and for it to all end like this is a real shame

[Doylo]

This is a misunderstanding, its Simpsons footage

[Doylo]

Sorry old things but I can't consider this as in anyway cedible evidence.

You would say that

[Jim]

Maybe its something to do with the whole heason scandle.
Its good to see that ben is cranking fairly hard and putting a few vids up, would be great if rich did the same

sorry, this is worded wrong, didn't mean I believed the stuff Ben did, i didn't, just good he got back into climbing.

[mrjonathanr]

?? You don't believe BH did the routes he claimed (maybe I read that wrong)?
Anyway.
I'm very much against casually damning RS with just a bit of vague information but you should note that vid does not show a link of Peky Pinky. It's edited.

[Jim]

No I don't believe the routes he claimed.
I didn't realise that pinky perky footage was edited, long time since I've seen it.
He was still strong as fuck anyway, that much I'm sure people aren't disputing

[roddersm]

I thought the Pinky Perky and other school room stuff was actual footage of him climbing the stuff and only the Action Direct "ascent" was edited? Doyle did you say that the school room footage wasn't taken by you or have I misread this?
 

[GCW]

[Sloper]

Sorry old things but I can't consider this as in anyway cedible evidence.

You would say that

I would because unsubtantiated second hand 'hearsay' isn't credible evidence. 

FFS the Bible has more credible 'hearsay' evidence.

[mrjonathanr]

He was still strong as fuck anyway, that much I'm sure people aren't disputing

A few people (Damo, Mick) seemed rather put out on the other channel when I said much the same thing.

[markwellin]

anyone else noticed a bit of cock at about 54 seconds in the pinky perky video?!

that mans got some balls to put that in

[Jim]

He was still strong as fuck anyway, that much I'm sure people aren't disputing

A few people (Damo, Mick) seemed rather put out on the other channel when I said much the same thing.

why?

[mrjonathanr]

why?

Because I criticised some of the playing at being psychologist type posts where people were assuming they knew that the ascents had not been made, and then went on to theorise... I said something about sticking to facts only, and that we only know that he was one of the very strongest sport climbers of the last decade, but not much more.

Damo in particular took issue with my use of the word 'know' arguing that I just believed what I'd seen in the media and didn't 'know' anything of the sort. Mick posted to back him up saying he was one of the few posters who really talked sense.

There's a valid point in there somewhere, but to imply that I'm apologising for/supporting RS and he may well have been weak as a kitten is just silly IMO.

[Jaspersharpe]

That pretty much sums up why I stopped posting on that site.

Oh hold on........

[Doylo]

We were in the school for about 4 hours that day, he did loads of hard problems on repeat, 1-5-9 campussing loads of times etc.. He got on Perky Pinky but didn't manage to do it in a oner so i spliced two sections together. You can't deny he was bastard strong. I mean Neil Mawson has climbed 8c and he's not in the same book never mind the same page in terms of strength. Malc Smith sent me a message recently, he sounded pretty dumbfounded by it all and said that Simpson was the strongest climber he'd ever seen (and he's seen a few). None of this means much as hard proof is needed but you can't deny he was strong enough.

[Doylo]

Sorry old things but I can't consider this as in anyway cedible evidence.

You would say that

I would because unsubtantiated second hand 'hearsay' isn't credible evidence. 

FFS the Bible has more credible 'hearsay' evidence.

This is probably why he doesn't get involved. People like you will never be satisfied.

[a dense loner]

anyone who doubts rich was strong is a fool, he was a monster on what he was good at. however, as we all know that is not pertinant to this discussion.
there are loads of strong people who can't climb and loads of very good climbers who are not strong.

to be honest i'm more disappointed with all this for people with unswerving loyalty like doylo and keith

[Sloper]

Sorry old things but I can't consider this as in anyway cedible evidence.

You would say that

I would because unsubtantiated second hand 'hearsay' isn't credible evidence. 

FFS the Bible has more credible 'hearsay' evidence.

This is probably why he doesn't get involved. People like you will never be satisfied.

What utter nonsense.

If I saw a video, I would be satisfied.
If a credible witness gave direct evidence that they saw the ascents I would be satisfied.

[Doylo]

If a credible witness gave direct evidence that they saw the ascents I would be satisfied.

Who is it you think is lying then, the Hubble LA witness or me?

[grimer]

to be honest i'm more disappointed with all this for people with unswerving loyalty like doylo and keith

Yes, it seems that the people who seemed to knew Rich a little better - Doylo, Ru, Alex Messenger and that - aren't so keen for blood. No reflection on the truth or not of Rich's claims, but still, in the face of other more vocal dagger-personalities, it gives one a better view of the world.

[Sloper]

If a credible witness gave direct evidence that they saw the ascents I would be satisfied.

Who is it you think is lying then, the Hubble LA witness or me?

If you said you'd seen x ascent then I'd believe you.

As I understand it person x is saying person y told them that they'd seen a video. 

I'm not saying anyone is lying what I'm saying is that the weight that can be attached to second hand hearsay is minimal. 

Ru can explain more about conditional admissibility but I'd say (given the edited videos that are in circulation compared to unedited one that are not) at best the statement is weak evidence that person y had seen a video and that's all.