[tomtom]

I'm glad the Internet, text messages and voicemail didn't exist when I was a teenager. 

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on only a child.

(Howzat for smug and superior??)

Thats better, a bit more smug 

[fatdoc]

I'm glad the Internet, text messages and voicemail didn't exist when I was a teenager. 

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on a child.

(Howzat for smug and superior??)

NOw that is certainly not legal

[Moo]

awww come on guys just think how dull the forum would be without him, can't we keep him pleeeeeeeeeeeeease?

[fatdoc]

as long as you don't feed him after midnight, or get him wet

[SA Chris]

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on a child.

According to his profile, he's 19. Allowed to vote and drink. Mind of a child possibly.

[Johnny Brown]

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on a child.

Especially when he's making a valid point. Not all of us had the luxury of growing up in a tight climbing scene where 'its just fucking wrong okay' is seen as a decent argument.

[Falling Down]

Exactly

[countotto]

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on a child.

Especially when he's making a valid point. Not all of us had the luxury of growing up in a tight climbing scene where 'its just fucking wrong okay' is seen as a decent argument.

Ok fair enough. I suppose restraint is called for, from those of us who know better. ... ... but the thing that really fried my noggin' is that  he seems not just blissfully, but willfully ignorant of the historical development of climbing and ethics that has led us to where we are in the UK. What's worse is that he seems to think it's ok to pick over the bones of fatuous and hackneyed questions that were resolved yonks ago- if only he wasn't too fucking LAZY to go and do some reading on the matter, and maybe a little bit of thinking. He might then understand some of the reasons why we no longer peg our way up London Wall, Coventry Street, Wellington Crack, Dateline,  etc and through simple extrapolation, apply this learning to guide his and others' behaviour. And his attitude seems to be that it's everyone else's responsibility to spend their time justifying to him and his rat boy clan and convince them of why they shouldn't do something that pisses off nearly every other poster, rather than him having the humility (humble in the face of 120 or so years of British climbing) to justify why it's acceptable to wind the clock back fifty years!

Furthermore, his posing of questions, some of which appearto be fair-minded and evidence-based, actually function to re-present resolved ethical issues as problems and therefore open to scrutiny, when the response on Cocktalk etc demonstrates that the consensus is that users are against DT at Millstone (or pegging, or bolting, or aiding, or hobnailing, or chipping, or wire-brushing, or any-fucking-thing that is likely to damage the rock for the future participation in rock climbing by the majority). Given that Forums on that site have a large number of climbing newbies looking for advice I don't think it's a good idea to allow rat-boys like this to post this sort of malicious nonsense without a stern challenge from the wise, here or anywhere else. He receives a variety of responses, some more strident than others, and long may we continue to do battle against the forces of utter pig-ignorance.

...in short, he's a malicious, ignorant gobshite whose agenda, such as it is, is self-publicity. Given that, losing patience with the obtuse little piece of shit and telling him to fuck off back to UKC may be quite an understandable response.

[nik at work]

Especially when he's making a valid point. Not all of us had the luxury of growing up in a tight climbing scene where 'its just fucking wrong okay' is seen as a decent argument.

Fair point but he does seem to have been part of a scene to enough of an extent to develop a keen sense of the "rightness" of onsight/ground-up rather than top-roping. Surely this is equally (if not more so) explained as "it's just fucking wrong okay".
He appears to have set out to deliberately shit stir, both here and on the other channel. Does he deserve the responses he's had? Well I think I'd generally err on a more restrained course (or no response at all) but maybe I'm a big (little) softy...

[Falling Down]

Yes, Franco can be, and is, at times a total dick but I'd also like to see some restraint in the responses as it just seems a bit OTT to be venting on a child.

Especially when he's making a valid point. Not all of us had the luxury of growing up in a tight climbing scene where 'its just fucking wrong okay' is seen as a decent argument.

Ok fair enough. I suppose restraint is called for, from those of us who know better. ... ... but the thing that really fried my noggin' is that  he seems not just blissfully, but willfully ignorant of the historical development of climbing and ethics that has led us to where we are in the UK.

Good answer.  I think the internet and blogging activities of famous and not so famous climbers is partly to blame.  Franco, if you're reading this, take note of what Otto has written.

[Jaspersharpe]

Think you're right FD but there's still no excuse for blatant cuntishness. Once again do I have to cite the fact that Ondra, Ty etc are under 20 and at under 16 "got it". Surely access to the internet should improve your knowlegde not be an excuse for you to make more of a TIT of yourself by being completely ignorant.

Wankers are wankers and age is no excuse.

[chummer]

my comment may have been a little bullyish but I really can't be fucked with folk coming on here who must know their assumed and self declared ignorance will wind people up by playing Devils advocate. Best served on the other channel if you ask me.


I'm not even sure any of that even made sense...

[Moo]

what jasper said, but if we scare franco off we might miss out on another si o'connor come on guys think of the future

[Sloper]

Look if this was a huge troll I actually think that a few scratches at the mebankment is a price well worth paying for such a well conceived and beautifully executed piece of, well, art.

Otherwise they're just cvnts.