[Moo]

erm i'm pretty sure the works and my house are pretty much equidistant from yours so lets not go making any rash decisions.

[Andy B]

That's a delayed reaction!

I can't decide so I think I'll just leave it.

Actually, does anyone know where Sloper lives? (only joking, obviously)

[BB]

Actually, does anyone know where Sloper lives? (only joking, obviously)

Choad Hall isn't it?

[Moo]

you walk quite slowly so there was no need to rush

[Andy B]

True, I'm scared of building up my leg muscles.

[shark]

I'll be heading out 7.30ish from Broomhill if anyone from this side of town wants a lift or even better can give me one   

[GraemeA]

I'll be heading out 7.30ish from Broomhill if anyone from this side of town wants a lift or even better can give me one   

Damn, I will have to change Question 7, which was going to be "Why is the co-owner of UKB called Shark" 

[shark]

I'll be heading out 7.30ish from Broomhill if anyone from this side of town wants a lift or even better can give me one   

Damn, I will have to change Question 7, which was going to be "Why is the co-owner of UKB called Shark" 

How about "Why was the co-owner of the Works formerly called Dodgy Graeme?"

[Johnny Brown]

Does your route from Broomhill run along Hangingwater road Shark?

[shark]

Can do - text me your house number 0777 3782763

[GraemeA]

 

[john horscroft]

You fuckin' sadist Graeme  that was the hardest quiz of all time - I had to leave early because I knew my score was going to be so laughable     

[shark]

Twas a good evening. Good turnout from UKB regulars: Johnny Brown, Dave, Nige, JonBoy, Obi-Wan-Is-Lost, AndyB and Cofe. I think thats it. All to be found on a table at the back of the room of course. GraemeA was of course quizmaestro.

Neil Foster is now heading the meetings. I don't know who he took over from or what previous meetings were like but I'm sure he will make future ones as lively, effective and grounded as he 'can'.

From what I remember issues discussed where crags on the periphery of the Peak I'd never heard of, the sale of North Lees and the Roaches and likely impact - particularly how it might effect the Whillans hut, loaning money to clubs for hut repairs.

Nice free buffet. Then Graemes epic quiz (3 days non-stop in the making apparently). Without wishing to come over as Smug and Superior^TM the UKB table crushed the quiz. There was an awesome array of prizes with Johnny Brown scoring a Rab duvet    There was so many prizes though that I dont think anyone left the room empty-hearted. The venue at the Maynards was a good pick - nice room, good acoustics and Moonshine at the bar - from my point of view it would good to see that as the regular venue.

 

[john horscroft]

Fuckin' ringers I say..... 

[Johnny Brown]

Well having managed to scoop the best prize I guess it falls to me to do next year's. I will ensure it doesn't require quite such an encylopedic knolwedge of Graeme's mates from the back.

[shark]

Oh crap. Does that mean its going to be all Puttrell and Ring Ouzels ?

[Johnny Brown]

I'm thinking mostly headpointing, some nest-chucking, and the rest spot-the-pat-king photo puzzles.

[john horscroft]

Oh crap. Does that mean its going to be all Puttrell and Ring Ouzels ?

At least that'd give Henry a chance of winning.......

[GraemeA]

Well having managed to scoop the best prize I guess it falls to me to do next year's. I will ensure it doesn't require quite such an encylopedic knolwedge of Graeme's mates, who used to have hair back in the day, from the back.

[shark]

Peak Area Meeting. Weds 2nd Feb Start time: 19:30 at The Maynard, Main Road, Derbyshire, Grindleford, S32 2HE

http://community.thebmc.co.uk/Event.aspx?id=459

The first half of the meeting will comprise a Question and Answer session with Mike Innerdale, the National Trust’s General Manager for the Peak District.

We have never had a one to one with a major landowner before so it’s a very special opportunity. So whether you’re a walker and/or a climber now is your chance to ask questions to, or put your points of view across to, the person with real influence and decision making power regarding the future of The Peak.

After a refreshment break (free sandwiches and chips – if they’re the same as in November, then not to be missed!) the agenda below will follow:

1.   Apologies
2.   Actions from the last meeting
3.   Access updates
4.   Burbage Valley
5.   Guidebooks update
6.   BMC Communities Website
7.   National Council Report
8.   Any other business
9.   Date, time and venue of the next meeting: Tuesday April 12th, 7.30pm, venue to be confirmed.

[Neil F]

Thank you Shark.  Just to add a couple of points:-


This is 1 week earlier than the proposed date we announced at the last meeting.  We were forced to amend this, so apologies to anyone who arranged their holidays to accommodate the old date! To re-iterate, the meeting will take place on 02/02/10 at 1930 at The Maynard Arms.


I think the importance of this meeting cannot be over-emphasised, and if you plan to attend just one meeting in the next year, this should probably be the one.

“Why is that?” I hear you ask.

The Peak District and the access we have traditionally enjoyed to its major cliffs is in a period of unprecedented change, following the Asset Review of the Peak District National Park. If someone had said to me 5 years ago, that ownership such iconic venues as The Roaches, Froggatt, Curbar and Stanage was going to change, and that access could be compromised as a result, I’d have probably thought you were pulling my leg. Yet this is precisely what has happened, and is happening right now, and if you don’t know the gory details then you probably should.

We have been extremely fortunate that Mike Innerdale, The National Trust General Manager for the Peak District, has agreed to attend this meeting and to take questions from the floor.

Why does this matter?

Well, The National Trust in partnership with the RSPB, has just secured the first package of crags offloaded by the Peak Park. This includes Froggatt, Curbar, Baslow and Birchens. The BMC collaborated on that successful bid – indeed our logo was on the cover of the bid document – so climbers interests should certainly be represented as a management strategy is adopted for this area.

The North Lees estate (including Stanage) is still up in the air, though a bid by the same partnership will probably be submitted.  The process is less advanced for the Roaches estate, and some sort of a collaborative bid by the National Trust and the BMC may be the best chance we have of retaining unrestricted access hereabouts. Come and ask Mike, if you don’t believe this threat is very live, and very real.

The National Trust also owns Kinder, Bleaklow and Lawrencefield. They also manage Burbage and Millstone.

At the same time, those allergic to gritstone may wonder why they should think about attending the meeting. Well, in case you didn’t realise it, Mike (or more accurately, his employers) own Dovedale, Beeston Tor, Thor’s Cave…

Oh, and if you still aren’t convinced, they also own Raven Tor.

Now are you coming?

Neil

[Johnny Brown]

Just to reinforce what Neil has said here, attendance here could really make a difference.

Back when we started the deal on the Eastern Moors (Froggatt - Curbar etc) it was in a very different economic climate. The NT and RSPB were looking to expand and enagage more with climbers and the uplands generally, and the National Park were looking to reduce their management costs a little. The partnership made great sense and all involved remain very committed to it.

Since the economic crisis and the new government, things have changed rapidly. Suddenly huge amounts of public land are looking to be sold or leased - not just National Park but Forestry Commission and others. At the same time subsidies for their care are likely to fall significantly. This is all supposed to be taken care of by 'the big society' - ie NGOs like the NT/RSPB partnership, the Wildlife trusts etc.

The problem is they are being overwhelmed. In many areas - like The Peak - these NGOs are already stretched by recent expansion and falling subscriptions (due to the economy). They simply don't have the resources to take on the management of all this land for the government. So what is going to happen? For some landscapes it will be okay - they may end up with a large NGO with both the expertise and resources to manage them. Others will slip through the net, and may end up with landowners who are either seriously under-resourced, or for whom access and conservation are simply not a priority.



Currently The Roaches in particular have a very uncertain future. Several expressions of interest have been made. Not all of these have much weight behind them. The RSPB are not interested; but a shooting group are. For the Staffs Wildlife Trust it would require a huge leap in both landholdings and access attitudes (you know how you aren't allowed to walk from Gib tor to Baldstones?). There is a local group who certainly care; but their resources and expertise are a big unknown.

The National Trust, who for many might seem the natural choice, are currently very unsure. One problem is that they do not have any other land in this area, meaning it would be far more expensive for them to manage than, say, Stanage. Especially at a time when they might be expanding elsewhere locally... you see the pattern. I'm not always psyched on their style of management, but look at the crags Neil lists above and try to think of any issues. They also have a huge advantage in that they declare land 'inalienable' - ie protection in perpetuity.

I think its fair to say The Roaches represent one of the 'big four' of Peak landscapes - the others being Kinder/ high moors, the Limestone Dales, and the Eastern Edges. All of these others are currently largely in safe hands. This is a huge opportunity to show the NT that The Roaches are of a similar importance (I'd personally put them solidly at the top for pure landscape value, though the others have compensating historical and ecological interest) - something which I honestly don't think they currently grasp. A show of numbers and concern at the area meet would be a good start in encouraging them to place the area somewhat higher on their agenda.

[Offwidth]

From Lynn:

BMC PEAK AREA MEETING - Wednesday 2nd February, 7.30pm, The Maynard, Grindleford.

The first half of the meeting will comprise a Question and Answer session with Mike Innerdale, the National Trust’s (NT) General Manager for the Peak District.

We have never had a one to one with a major landowner before so it’s a very special opportunity. So whether you’re a walker and/or a climber now is your chance to ask questions to, or put your points of view across to, the person with real influence and decision making power regarding the future of The Peak.

The NT own most of the gritstone moors and lots of the crags we climb on (Lawrencefield, Yarncliffe, Kinder, Ravens Tor, Beeston Tor, Thor's Cave, Dovedale), and will also be looking after Curbar, Froggatt, Birchens with the RSPB. Are they going to try and acquire the Roaches too, and what about Stanage? They manage Burbage and Millstone for grazing but not for recreation: what developments can we expect there. Do they have issues with climbers anywhere - bolts, gardening, dry tooling - do they have problems with walkers -Kinder, Bleaklow, Alport. Other issues may be mountain biking, off roading and predator control. Mike is happy to take questions on the lot. If you care about the Peak, its future and your enjoyment of it, this really is a unique opportunity.

Hope to see you there, Regards, Lynn Robinson (secretary, Peak Area)

[Offwidth]

...sorry about the repeated content but it is important (and of course it's normally wise for me to do what Lynn asks).

[dave]

People should get the fuck along to this meeting. Even without a quiz to clean up at.