[Jim]

really good venue. will be going back again soon

[BenF]

Nice one, let me know when you can get back and I'll try to meet you.

[tomtom]

Me & Tris are planning to be there from 6 ish on thurs weather permitting if anyone else is interested/about.
T

[BenF]

Damn, meant to pm Tris about this as he mailed me but I can't get on my pm's at work at the moment (damned web filtering).  Doubt that I'll be able to make it sadly, which is annoying because I really want to show people around the place.  If anything changes and I can get there I'll see you around six, but I doubt it.

[Johnny Brown]

Had a great couple of hours here yesterday - great little venue. Boysen turned up, said he'd been going for forty years. So much for a new crag - looking foward to the cheshire guide for more unsung gems.

[Falling Down]

Is this the famed 'Boysen's secret sandstone crag' ? or are there more? (I heard Altrincham...)

[Tris]

I live in Altrincham and I am still searching for this mystery venue 

[Johnny Brown]

I don't think so. I think the secret crag is nearer Manchester, and is secret due to being very fragile. Harmer's is pretty solid for sandstone.

[BenF]

Had a great couple of hours here yesterday - great little venue. Boysen turned up, said he'd been going for forty years. So much for a new crag - looking foward to the cheshire guide for more unsung gems.

Glad to hear you liked it.  Did you look at the little quarry too? 

Naturally Martin, Tom, no doubt Rab and a whole host of older Chester climbers have been going there for years (I keep meeting "new" people there), its just they wouldn't let anyone into their secret.  And when interested folk did ask about the place (and not just to Martin and Tom), they were usually given very little information - giving the quarry a place in local climbing folklore.  However, Martin and Tom have now been very open and even given Andy and I the names of the stuff that they'd climbed before we got involved. 

Hopefully now it can get the traffic it deserves since the trust that own the wood are keen to see the place used by different user groups.  I doubt it'll ever be mega popular but more traffic will keep it cleaner and hopefully in condition for more of the year.  There is plenty of quality to rival other local venues, in a setting that's really quite beautiful.

Is this the famed 'Boysen's secret sandstone crag' ? or are there more? (I heard Altrincham...)

No, definitely not.  I haven't seen this secret crag and had the shut down when asking about it, but I know someone who's been there and they said pretty much what JB said earlier (i.e. it's near Altrincham and very fragile).

[BenF]

Oh and here's a few more photos.  Can't seem to link to larger size photos in flickr so apologies for the rather small size. 

Check out that beautiful rib in the second shot.  Adam, I presume you did that one when you visited?
 
          

[Johnny Brown]

You really think its been kept a secret? I'd think its more a case that the area is a bit of a backwater, there hasn't been a guidebook for years, the Altrincham All-stars etc come from a generation which didn't bother putting bouldering in guides etc etc. Not so long ago this would have been regarded as a really minor venue. Plus I imagine there is a bit of a gap between the locals with all the knowledge and the current boulderers. Have you had much contact with the Vags, I daresay their tuesday night scenes would have passed here?

Yeah that rib is great, last move was a bit spicy without a chalkbag! Did a couple of hardish lines (7a+ ish) - the wall bounding the left of the long wall with the crack, and the line at the right end of the long wall (think Crouch is on it in a pic higher up).

We'd didn't go in the other quarry, Martin said it was more of a top-roping venue. He also pointed us at a line which he'd top-roped in the past, which looked to be the right-hand of Andy's projects.

[BenF]

Sorry, I suppose I shouldn't have suggested it had been kept a massive secret, but there was a definite reticence to tell people what had and hadn't been climbed.  I've been told by people that it shouldn't be in a guide and that the problems shouldn't have names or grades.  As you say though, this is probably due to cultural/generational/outlook differences.

Yes, I've spoken to and climbed at Harmer's with many many people, including of course plenty of Vags members.  They did climb many of the lines years ago (on Tuesday nights as you say), along with Martin and Tom et al.  Certainly I wouldn't suggest that many of the lines there are new lines, other than about half a dozen of the harder things that Andy and I have climbed (and cleaned).  Speaking to Martin, Tom, everyone and their dogs has given us a good idea of what had been climbed in the past.

I think the lines you talk about are the wonderful Babyblock (on the rh end of the curved wall, via a lovely left hand pinch, about 7a+/b) and just left of that curved wall, High Heaven (with a harsh start to press down a two finger pocket and reach miles to a little edge, about 7a?). 

[Johnny Brown]

I've been told by people that it shouldn't be in a guide and that the problems shouldn't have names or grades

That's fair enough - a similar ethic exists for the Grinah Stones. I'm a big fan of leaving the odd venue undocumented so everyone gets to discover it afresh.

a definite reticence to tell people what had and hadn't been climbed

I'd guess this would be at least in part due to no one knowing! With the talent that will have visited over the years, its probably safer to assume everything has been done before, at least on top-rope. I guess suddenly naming everything could come across a bit presumptuous to anyone who's been going a while. Its definitely a venue that doesn't need a guidebook - lines are obvious - but it would be daft to do a cheshire guide without it.

I think the lines you talk about are the wonderful Babyblock (on the rh end of the curved wall, via a lovely left hand pinch, about 7a+/b) and just left of that curved wall, High Heaven (with a harsh start to press down a two finger pocket and reach miles to a little edge, about 7a?). 

Yep, they sound spot on.

[BenF]

I guess suddenly naming everything could come across a bit presumptuous to anyone who's been going a while.

True. 

That's fair enough - a similar ethic exists for the Grinah Stones. I'm a big fan of leaving the odd venue undocumented so everyone gets to discover it afresh.

Again, true.  However I get a bit annoyed at people deliberately not telling other people about particular crags just so that they can keep their own little spot to themselves - not that I'm suggesting people have done this about Harmer's or that we shouldn't keep certain venues low key for access or ecological reasons.

Anyway, thanks for your feedback and sound reasoning.

[Tris]

However I get a bit annoyed at people deliberately not telling other people about particular crags just so that they can keep their own little spot to themselves

Tell me about it, I would love to be let into the secret of the Altrincham training venue. OK I don't climb 8A but I have been climbing for over 20 years, so am very unlikely to go damaging some piece of fragile rock that is right on my doorstep ffs... what do you have to do to gain this information 

I have literally spent days searching the countryside round Altrincham for it! 

[Johnny Brown]

Dunno if the All-stars tuesday night scene is still going, but that's where I'd start. I daresay someone (Martin probably) found the place for themselves originally, so it can't be impossible. Have you looked round Lymm?

[Tris]

I've been to the dam but not explored too much in that area?
I have also visited most of the sandstone bridges in the area as I saw in a UKC thread that someone had a photo of Boysen training on a bridge. Have found some funky bridges but nothing much good for climbing on

There's an ok traversy thing on a wall near the canal at Dunham Massey, but not very hard.

Also some green covered walls near the NT mill in Styal.. bit dark and slimy though...

[Johnny Brown]

There's an ok traversy thing on a wall near the canal at Dunham Massey, but not very hard.

Could be that - I don't think its that good a venue. The legend is more to do with the secrecy.

[Tris]

Sorry - it's a man made wall (bricks/mortar etc) and is complete total bobbins really... you'd have more fun on the outside of your house! I only mentioned it as there ain't a lot of climbable places in Alty!

I have spotted some more potential places using Google Earth so will continue the search   

[Ally Smith]

Did both of these last nigt on my first visit. I was very impressed, especially with Babyblock.

I think the lines you talk about are the wonderful Babyblock (on the rh end of the curved wall, via a lovely left hand pinch, about 7a+/b) and just left of that curved wall, High Heaven (with a harsh start to press down a two finger pocket and reach miles to a little edge, about 7a?).

I intially tried the 6b+ rib thing (in one of the photos above) with blinkers on and thought it harder than the wall with monos next to it! Use everything and it's a peach too.

Has anyone done the full traverse?

[Falling Down]

I'm a big fan of leaving the odd venue undocumented so everyone gets to discover it afresh.

That's what GME is trying to describe on t'other thread.

[Johnny Brown]

He may be 'trying' to, but its not the impression he gives out. I don't mean keeping secrets, I just mean no problem names or descriptions. By all means put them in guides, on the net, talk them up all you like, just have the crag itself an antidote to the ticklists that folk treat crags as nowadays.

[Jim]

you could always not look at a guide book next time you venture beyond burbage west word 

[BenF]

Did both of these last nigt on my first visit. I was very impressed, especially with Babyblock.

I intially tried the 6b+ rib thing (in one of the photos above) with blinkers on and thought it harder than the wall with monos next to it! Use everything and it's a peach too.

Has anyone done the full traverse?

Good stuff.  Did you do the wall with the monos just right of the rib?  Its got a big move leaving the last mono to tiny crimps then a slap to the top of the wall.

The traverse was jokingly given V4 by someone.  It's not.  I'm sure someone with time on their hands has done it but no-one has owned up to it yet (I know that Mr Popp has done bits of it and rated it).  I keep meaning to try it.

[youngy]

Ahh Ben im so psyched to get here when my finger is not so injured!!