[Iesu]

Finally had it with C'dale Headshok fatty wank bollocks

decided to take the plunge, pay for a new set of forks, take the bastards to the small claims court and hope i can claim back the outlay on a new set....

so

I need recommendations for _short travel xc MTB forks. I'd love to thrash down the canal on some 6" All mountain beasts but unfortunately as the stock fork was only 80mm travel the fork won't accommodate much over 100mm forks (i don't think).

Can anyone advise on what the required headtube reducers do to the stack height dropping down to 1 1/8th? Apparently the C'dale SI system is *almost* the same as a 1.5 spec head tube but *not quite* - bastards.

Tempted by some DT Swiss and Pace forks on the Pace website, but i am wary of their reliability.

measuring the axle to crown length is tricky with this integrated headshok as well, it's not making much sense.

don't want to spend much more than 400 notes if i can help it - also bear in mind that i'll be needing the headset reducer cups and a new headset plus new stem!!!

any help appreciated

ps went to Guisburn on sunday and it was awesome

[fatdoc]

Fox.


they actually have forks not made of cheese...

takes me 24 months to break them.. ( 3 weeks for some others)

you get what you pay for with forks I'm afraid...

It costs..but they work.

[Norton Sharley]

 

I have a set of pretty much unused Fox Float 130's for sale that with a bit of internal dabbling can be easily be changed to 100mm.  PM me if you are interested.  Will sell for typical eBay price minus a bit, whatever that comes to.  Travel change is a design feature and not a Norton bodge   .

Not sure about reducers for the headtube.

Headset; buy a Hope, they last ages and the sealed cartridge bearings are replacable so you don't need a new headset every couple of years.

I also have a 1 1/8" to 25mm x 70 or 80mm stem for sale if you are interested?

[gremlin]

I've got a set of Fox Talas Forx R's for sale (100/120/140mm). Only used them about 4 times, just starting to bed in. 300 notes plus postage (if required).

PM me if interested :-)

[northerngreg]

I recently fitted a pair of Rock Shox SID World Cups to a customers Cannondale. I used a Hope 1.5" to 1 1/8" stepdown headset - no separate reducer needed. It was very simple to fit and all worked very nicely indeed.

Apparently the C'dale SI system is *almost* the same as a 1.5 spec head tube but *not quite* - bastards.

This is what some people told me too, but others thought that the newer Cannondales were 1.5". It all fitted so I was either lucky or they are all 1.5".

Personally I'm always a Rock Shox man having been afflicted with Fox sticky bushingitis a few years back I'd never touch them again.

[john horscroft]

Just had a look at my F500 which I converted two years back and I fitted a Cane Creek Double X:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=7394

Works well and it's taken some right punishment.

Have no fear about fitting longer than 100mm forks, it'll take it!

In fact combine them with these:

http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=47093

And you've got the whole lot done for £400!   

[BB]

Word on the street is that since DT got involved with Pace they've ironed out the reliability issues and sorted the poor quality control. They've also doubled the price though. I can't fault fox, they may not be lightest in class but I've got 80mm floats on my scott and they've taken everything I can throw at them.

[Iesu]

I recently fitted a pair of Rock Shox SID World Cups to a customers Cannondale. I used a Hope 1.5" to 1 1/8" stepdown headset - no separate reducer needed. It was very simple to fit and all worked very nicely indeed.

Apparently the C'dale SI system is *almost* the same as a 1.5 spec head tube but *not quite* - bastards.

This is what some people told me too, but others thought that the newer Cannondales were 1.5". It all fitted so I was either lucky or they are all 1.5".

Personally I'm always a Rock Shox man having been afflicted with Fox sticky bushingitis a few years back I'd never touch them again.

cheers for that, also backed up by the man at chevin cycles this afternoon

definitely going for hope headset (maybe matching stem too...)

haven't decided what forks i want so ta for the offers - I'll keep you posted

ps away to pembrokeshire til the following weekend tomorrow so don't expect a swift resolution!

[Iesu]

Word on the street is that since DT got involved with Pace they've ironed out the reliability issues and sorted the poor quality control. They've also doubled the price though. I can't fault fox, they may not be lightest in class but I've got 80mm floats on my scott and they've taken everything I can throw at them.

what you reckon to these then http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/Models.aspx?ModelID=33723?

bargain or a liability? - also they may be 30mm too long for my frame (anyone got clues as to how much stack height the reducer headset will add/take away from the C'dale SI system headset?)

decisions decisions

not that fussed on uber reliability - I'm happy to see the forks away once every 6 months to Pace for a service, but once in 2-4 RIDES when it's mainly DOWN THE FRIGGING CANAL TOWPATH TO WORK is a bit much if you ask me. rather.

esp as they're making me pay for blown cartridges as it's out of it's measly 1 yr warranty

plus I may get some rigid forks for commuting (get a spare crown race from hope for them) and save the springs for the fuzzy tingle trail times.....

[Norton Sharley]

I'm happy to see the forks away once every 6 months to Pace for a service

Are you mad?  Fox's last years without a service

£150 for brand new second hand Floats (from me  ) or £400 notes for unreliable Pace 

How long do you need the steerer tube to be?

Have a nice time in Pembroe

[BB]

Looks like a bargain, but I've seen too many pace forks with problems to trust them completely. Pace rigid forks though, that's a different matter entirely! They have a superb rep.

I'd still go with fox though. Mine have got just under 10,000 miles on them and havn't been serviced yet!

[Iesu]

Looks like a bargain, but I've seen too many pace forks with problems to trust them completely. Pace rigid forks though, that's a different matter entirely! They have a superb rep.

all advice welcomed and that received duly noted - re the pace rigids - I've broken two pairs of them in the past (one in a collision with a car) but then i do weigh over 90Kg

[Norton Sharley]

You'll be needing me to put some more air in the Float's then!

[fatdoc]

I'm happy to see the forks away once every 6 months to Pace for a service

Are you mad?  Fox's last years without a service

£150 for brand new second hand Floats (from me  ) or £400 notes for unreliable Pace 

How long do you need the steerer tube to be?

Have a nice time in Pembroe

I agree, even I dont break Fox forks... they work, they cost vast sums new, they are sold a plenty 2nd hand... why?? coz they are still fit for purpose.

new other fork vs. 2nd hand fox....

go fox

[northerngreg]

I'd still go with fox though. Mine have got just under 10,000 miles on them and havn't been serviced yet!

You might want to slide the lowers off to check the stanchions - I've seen too many forks that have seemingly been ok on the outside and absolutely shafted on the inside all because they've never been apart. A new crown-steerer-upper is a lot of $$$$$ !

[fatdoc]

£130 for Fox 32s... I should know.. i destroyed some stanchions last month... 

[James Yeah]

Fox forks should actually be serviced every 6 month, you can do it at home but if you don't service them the stanchions generally wear and they get a bit sticky. (yes you can go without servicing them but it's not recommended and Fox say to service every 3 -6 months for their top end forks.  You should service any fork roughly every 6 months (depending on usage)  though to keep them running smoothly)

I wouldn't bother with DT or Pace myself, old Pace stuff used to be amazing, new stuff not so much, Never been a fan of Dt forks either, they never felt to great when i've tried them. 


Personally i'd get either a set of Rockshox Sids or Fox F100's for pure xc duties.  (This depends what front wheel you run as well, whether it's qr, fox 15mm, 20mm etc)

I like rockshox myself but that's only cause i run a set of Lyriks and i found them better on small bump sensitivity than the 32's and 36's i tried.  Although they did bugger up very quickly, Rockshox sorted them out and upgraded them for free and they're still running great a year later.


Whatever forks you get, get some of their fork lube,  it's amazing.  Helps forks no end:   http://www.juicelubes.co.uk/

As for a stem, why buy anything other than Thomson?

My 2p

[Iesu]

I'm happy to see the forks away once every 6 months to Pace for a service

Are you mad?  Fox's last years without a service

£150 for brand new second hand Floats (from me  ) or £400 notes for unreliable Pace 

How long do you need the steerer tube to be?

Have a nice time in Pembroe

cheers for the offer but i think i'm going to have to buy new - mainly because i have no idea of how long the steerer tube will need to be once i've had the reducer headset put in (seems pretty hard to judge with the headshok currently installed)

[Iesu]

well i bit the bullet and bought a pair of 2008 DT Swiss XMC100's (longest the frame will take apparently) online for not too much money. Unfortunately having to buy the reducing headset, new inch and eighth stem and have it fitted (don't have the tools to even get the old headshok off...) added another hundred notes to the costs of buying a bike with shit forks factory fitted....

Anyway, the good news is that the new forks blow the old ones out of the water, buttery smooth and the launch control lockout works as advertised. I've only had it out on singletrack a couple of times over the past couple of weeks and can't complain with the stiffness compared to the rigid fork blades of the headshok. I'm still setting them up just right, and not having had forks with decent damping controls before i'm not too sure if i'm getting it right.

but the feeling's good and that's all that matters. I'll post back with any news regarding reliability, but the manual reckons they only need servicing every 200 hrs of riding (or 12 months) which seems reasonable. Given that when I'm in the office I'm probably getting 6-7hrs a week use out of them.

One last question: I read on the TF Tuned website that the wiper seals on the stanchions should be cleaned regularly by wiping down, applying some chain oil and pumping the forks, cleaning the muck off the stanchions as it is revealed. Is this right, or should I be using some "special" fork oil?

cheers

[john horscroft]

I'm a big fan of Tftuned and their advice is usually pretty good.  I've been following that regime for some time and it works for me.   

[Norton Sharley]

I'd say that wiping down means clean your bike after you ride it.  I don't like putting oil on the fork stanchions as it just attracts more crap.  A good tip is to turn your bike upside down for a few minutes before you ride, especially if you haven't ridden for a while.  This lets the oil in the forks soak the wiper seals.  Just remember to check your brakes by pumping them before riding as any air trapped in the calipers can find it's way into the master cylinder or hoses which might mean your brakes don't work.  Pumping the brakes drives the air back out.  If this is the case you should really bleed your brakes.  If you must put oil on your stanchions then summer (thin) chain oil is fine.

[john horscroft]

I'd say that wiping down means clean your bike after you ride it.  I don't like putting oil on the fork stanchions as it just attracts more crap.  A good tip is to turn your bike upside down for a few minutes before you ride, especially if you haven't ridden for a while.  This lets the oil in the forks soak the wiper seals.  Just remember to check your brakes by pumping them before riding as any air trapped in the calipers can find it's way into the master cylinder or hoses which might mean your brakes don't work.  Pumping the brakes drives the air back out.  If this is the case you should really bleed your brakes.  If you must put oil on your stanchions then summer (thin) chain oil is fine.

Good point his Sharleyness.  I just use light chain oil, pump a couple of times and then wipe off the excess.  Haven't had any problem with muck sticking to stanchions so far.   

[Iesu]

I'd say that wiping down means clean your bike after you ride it.  I don't like putting oil on the fork stanchions as it just attracts more crap.  A good tip is to turn your bike upside down for a few minutes before you ride, especially if you haven't ridden for a while.  This lets the oil in the forks soak the wiper seals.  Just remember to check your brakes by pumping them before riding as any air trapped in the calipers can find it's way into the master cylinder or hoses which might mean your brakes don't work.  Pumping the brakes drives the air back out.  If this is the case you should really bleed your brakes.  If you must put oil on your stanchions then summer (thin) chain oil is fine.

The manual with the DT Swiss forks explicitly says not to store the bike upside-down because it messes with the launch control lock-out by letting air in, but this can be remedied by "pumping" the forks to prime the damping system again.

confused dot com

brakes are another matter altogether, I've got a sticky (cracked) piston in me avid juicy 3's from being a bit too enthusiastic with a screwdriver to push the piston back into the caliper

result = brake drag constantly, oh well in for a service i guess (i'll fix just about anything but the manual on piston replacement recommends using an air compressor to push the pistons out - not got one - and i don't fancy dealing with dot hydraulic fluid all over the place either!

[fatdoc]

I'd say that wiping down means clean your bike after you ride it.  I don't like putting oil on the fork stanchions as it just attracts more crap.  A good tip is to turn your bike upside down for a few minutes before you ride, especially if you haven't ridden for a while.  This lets the oil in the forks soak the wiper seals.  Just remember to check your brakes by pumping them before riding as any air trapped in the calipers can find it's way into the master cylinder or hoses which might mean your brakes don't work.  Pumping the brakes drives the air back out.  If this is the case you should really bleed your brakes.  If you must put oil on your stanchions then summer (thin) chain oil is fine.

I agree ...

I'm also a fan of good quality silicone spray on the forks....

both Mazz & fox forks work waaayy betta with some inversion therapy...

[Norton Sharley]

Iesu - not stored upside down but turned upside down for 5 minutes before riding to let the oil run onto the seals and wipers.

Sticky pistons can often be cured by some KY

[Iesu]

got an air compressor at work i could borrow - anyone tried this avid caliper surgery?

[heelhookofglory]

I've done this many times in the workshop but I just used a track pump and that was plenty to pop out the piston, as long as you cover all other air escape points of course. Very easy to do and will sort your problem nicely. Use a little bit of a nice silicone lube on the seals / piston edges when re-assembling as grease can introduce air into your brake fluid :-)

Give me a shout if you need any pointers but it really is very straight forward.

[Iesu]

I've done this many times in the workshop but I just used a track pump and that was plenty to pop out the piston, as long as you cover all other air escape points of course. Very easy to do and will sort your problem nicely. Use a little bit of a nice silicone lube on the seals / piston edges when re-assembling as grease can introduce air into your brake fluid :-)

Give me a shout if you need any pointers but it really is very straight forward.

ta, between brake rub and headwinds i'm starting to hate riding down the canal to work!