[Jim Franklin]

Gents, so you do not think this has been forgotten about now the dust has settled. I have now had confirmation from several interested parties, including South Yorks Police, Peak District Authority and other groups that they will be meeting me on 12th February.

We are meeting at about 09:30hrs where Houndkirk Road and Hathersage Road meet near to the outdoor activity centre.

If anyone would like to come along to represent the members here and the wider bouldering community we would welcome you, but please do remember that this is a meeting to resolve issues and look for ways forward for ALL. The priority has to be the Moor and working within the framework of the organisations that have put in so much work and effort over the last 5 years or so. This is not about personal or group agendas and I simply ask that all that attend do so with a cool head. Please remember that South Yorks Police will be present for the same reason as everyone else, but I am sure that if someone is disruptive etc they will take appropriate action.

Please gentlemen, lets keep this civil and mature, everyone actually has the same end game here, we are just approaching it from different angles.

[john horscroft]

I'll be there Jim.  Know couple of the SY police who've been involved and probably the PDNPA rep too.  I'll be good, I promise..........

[slackline]

Hmm, its a Friday, so I'll be working then 

[Jim Franklin]

I'll be there Jim.  Know couple of the SY police who've been involved and probably the PDNPA rep too.  I'll be good, I promise..........

That will be good John...and good behaviour too...

[hairich]

why have you organised this meet for when 99% of the forum are at work

[fatdoc]

friday is a 12 hour day for me..

having said that those that can attend know my stance & I'm happy they represent me.

keep us all informed...

plz keep the place open for mtb.... plz.... [ my first ever ride, my eldest son's & the 2nd... huge emotional value for me.. for a scraggy desecrated moor]

[hairich]

john i dont have the same "endgame" as franklin at all.ban the fuckin 4 by 4 out of the peak off road for good is my "endgame"

[Jim Franklin]

why have you organised this meet for when 99% of the forum are at work

Simple really, Most of those who will be attending this meet are public officials who are paid 9-5 Monday to Friday and as nothing can be resolved without the input of the Park Authority, the Police and numerous other Local Authority Agencies we need to meet when it's convenient to the majority.

I will be there on the Saturday, but as you freely admit that your "end game" is to ban 4x4's then there is no common ground we would find and meeting you would be like pissing in the wind...It would simply waste your time and my time and I think you would agree we both have better things to do than waste time.

This thread is not the place for a discussion on the merits or not of using a 4x4, so perhaps you would be so kind as to pm your thoughts and justifications to me so that they may go into the report; if your reasoning is justified and can be supported by evidence.

Jim

[Sloper]

The attendance of the police is substantially irrelevant as what we're talking about is a change in the classification of the road.

Frankly I'd be amazed if you get a pc to attend for what is essentially a walk in the hills esp when there's already an operation underway and no evidence of infringement ongoing.

If you're talking about people getting 'done' by the Police, do grow up.

[john horscroft]

Well, being an utter slacker, I'm going.  So, pm your thoughts to me or, if you can't be arsed, I'll just form an opinion based on this thread.

Fear not FD - mbing on Houndkirk is NOT in danger.  It's a special place for me too.

Sloper - that's the thing about Tim Cross Tom, he really cares about this shit, so if he or one of his team can make it, they will.  And as for infringement, all the signs on the summit and some on the gates have been torn down and the tracks in the snow on wednesday clearly showed that an early morning 4x4er had been trialling over the summit.  Oh yeah, it's still going on.........

And Jim, good behaviour doesn't mean I'm not going to be just a tinsy bit pissed off!  This is far from the first meeting I've had on Houndkirk Moor to address this thorny litttle issue and I'm getting a bit frustrated by the utter lack of progress...............

[Jim Franklin]

The attendance of the police is substantially irrelevant as what we're talking about is a change in the classification of the road.

Frankly I'd be amazed if you get a pc to attend for what is essentially a walk in the hills esp when there's already an operation underway and no evidence of infringement ongoing.

If you're talking about people getting 'done' by the Police, do grow up.

Tim Cross from South Yorks Police has stated that he WILL be attending as this is not just about a "walk in the hills". This is about resolving long standing issues due to some thoughtless and ignorant butt wipes who happen to own 4x4's who simply refuse to obey the law and common decency, plus a lot of misconceptions about the different user groups from other user groups.

My agenda is simple...find a way to protect the Moor and to allow as much practical access for all the interested groups as is both practical and enforceable.

Make no mistake, as much as I would not want any user group banned from this area, if the ONLY way to prevent this illegal use and the destruction of the Moor then I would support a total ban of either motor vehicles or anything that does not involve walking..That would be a blooming disaster and should be avoided at all costs, but ultimately the Moor is what is important.

I think the Police from both Sth Yorks and Derbyshire have shown that, as far as they are able, they have taken the actions necessary to eliminate illegal drivers on the Moor over the last 5-10 years, but they cannot do this truly successfully without the input of the public at large. This is also true of the Peaks Authority and the County Council. The simple solution for all would be a ban on all but foot traffic, but they have repeatedly refused to go down this route due to the impact it would have on so many and they too want people to enjoy this beautiful location.

I have no desire to argue with anyone and all I ask is that people who are open minded enough to make a positive impact on what I am trying to do will take part and help, I do not expect us to agree on everything, that is life, but we all have the same end game..protect the Moor and in the process the ability of people to enjoy it by whatever method rocks their respective boat.

I know John will be there on Friday and I expect him to be vociferous in his opinion, I would not want or expect anything less, so if anyone else wishes to be there on Friday please do make your way there.

[john horscroft]

Like Jim says......So, if anyone can't make it friday and would like me to act as their proxy, let me know on this thread or by pm..............

[dave]

You can be the proxy proxy for all 9-5ers word.

[Johnny Brown]

I'm afraid I'll be in Scotland so won't be able to make it. I hope some progress can be made though - good luck.

If things go well, can I suggest something similar for the Long Causeway? I'd certainly make myself available for that.

My views on both are simple - motorised recreation is not compatible with moorland of such wildlife value, nor in landscape of such national value, nor with the right of others to quiet enjoyment of the countryside.

I trust you'll represent me right John.

[Joepicalli]

I'll be there. It will be good to meet you: Jim and John both.

[john horscroft]

I'll be there. It will be good to meet you: Jim and John both.

Wear your UKB T-shirt Joe, otherwise a sniper might get you..................

[Joepicalli]

I'll be there. It will be good to meet you: Jim and John both.

Wear your UKB T-shirt Joe, otherwise a sniper might get you..................

I'll be the one in the muddy Landy Disco (shurley shome mishtake).

[dave]

What happens if someone wants to come who's name doesn't start with J?

[john horscroft]

What happens if someone wants to come who's name doesn't start with J?

What do you reckon Joe?  Are D's allowed??

[dave]

I'll be doing a job of work on friday. Just spitballing theoretically.

[john horscroft]

Then, purely theoretically Dave, you're more than welcome to join us............................

[Jim Franklin]

Gents...sadly I cannot attend the moor tomorrow. My 1 year old daughter has been diagnosed with pneumonia today after being ill for several weeks. I need to be here with my partner and children as a result.

I have emailed all those that were to attend to let them know and pm'ed John so he is aware.

I will liaise with all those who were to attend and arrange another day in the next few weeks, hopefully with enough lead time to allow a few more to attend..i know that some wanted to but work interfered.

Please accept my apologies, but I am sure you will understand that my family has to come first.

Jim

[slackline]

Sorry to hear about that hope she gets better soon.

Why can't it go ahead anyway?  Obviously you won't be able to do the Roni Size for your user-group, but the authorities who are to police the area will be there and something useful/productive could still be achieved 

[Joepicalli]

Being a fuckwit I didn't read Jim's e-mail so I turned up. It was still worthwhile with the National Park guys giving me a very Real World perspective on the 4x4 issue and the Houndskirk's suitability as a 4x4 venue for responsible users.
Really sorry to hear about your kid Jim hope she perks up soon and will look forward to meeting you when you can re-arrange.

[john horscroft]

   Good to see you up there Joe!  I'm kinda glad we didn't have a full meeting - I'd've ended up hypothermic! And it was wet across Blacka, oh yes.....................