We have to leave the country to get on long stamina plods.
It makes us all look like wads when we are on holiday
So do the people I'm referring to, that's my point, that people living in many Continental cities and climbing hard face exactly the same difficulties as Brits (OK, the weather might not be quite so crap, but the foothills of the Alps are not exactly the south of Spain or Sardinia). With low cost flights Brits can get to the south of Spain/France/Italy in roughly the same time and maybe cheaper than people from Milan, Vienna,...
There seems to be the assumption that sports climbing = "stamina plods". I can only speak really about Sardinia where we live...and can tell you that the 8a "vertical" or "overhanging slabs" round here see a lot fewer ascents, and if you do them you get much more respect, that the steep big-holes routes at Isili which never get wet so you see all the chalk...
Re Stevie's 9a- Gaz went there this year and got beasted on a 8a, he said the place was BEASTLY! Respect.
Surely you're not comparing a 6-7 hour drive to driving to the airport, parking, flying, driving, accommodation etc. Its simply not the same and low cost is not low cost (fuel, parking, flight, tax, rental, accom) compared to a tank of fuel and sleeping in your van? Thats just nonce sense
The majority of hard routes aren't in that style though are they? Rhetorical.
Ferry from mainland Italy to Sardinia return €300 with cabin (is overnight) but you do have your car here, makes Ryanair+Easyjet's 6 weekly 2,5 hour flights + car hire not seem too bad a deal. Once you get here accommodation is cheap. I guess Spain and France similar.
Many of the 8a wall climbs round here have only had 1-2 ascents...
It depresses me that it appears the world must revolve around sport climbing.
The grade thing is important, if i want to try an 8c on my local cliffs i have a choice of three, all of which are ridiculously hard for 8c. I know i could do one with half the effort at Margalef etc... LPT has fickle conditions and its tidal, Malham and Raven Tor are often either too hot or too wet and Kilnsey too cold or to wet. Its a battle trying to climb hard in this country.
Are you saying there are as many strong Europeans living in places which are crap for climbing as there are in places which have the advantages mentioned in the old thread (weather, high quality crags to inspire, good sport/comp scenes, routes with extensions, routes which are less conditions dependent, steep long routes etc)? Can you back that up, because it would surprise me. Where do most of the best Italian climbers live - close to the good sport climbing (with some of the above advantages) or far away from it? I know nothing about Italy or it's climbers but I'd know what my guess would be
You seem to be asking one question and answering another. I'm not sure how the existence of your 8c+ climbing mate from Milan and the assertion that the 8a wall climbs in Sardinia are harder than the steep ones say anything about the reasons why British climbing standards seem lower than elsewhere.
Once again I think this will help explain the matter more clearly: