[lukeyboy]

Hi - does anybody know which of the bivvy sites in font are currently open? I'm heading out next week and ideally would like to stay at the bourron marlotte one, but any info on the one near hippodrome would also be useful. If anyone has been out recently (or just is in the know) then info on either of those (or are there more?) would be most appreciated. Cheers

[RedFox]

Kett and I are in Chamonix and might be there when you are (it's raining).  Let us know when/if you get here and where you go.  Who else is going?

My number if you don't have = 0044 7525 6309 (six minus 1) 7

Kisses 

[lukeyboy]

Sweet. We'll get there late saturday morning (i.e. the 19th) and be leaving on the following sunday morning (i.e. the 27th). Give me a text if you're about in the forest and I'll let you know where we're heading that day or where we're staying. My number is still the same, you should have it I think.

In terms of whose going, it's just me and charlotte but it sounds like other people will be there at the same time. I think emily and her bf are probably there by now, not sure when they're staying til. And I think there is also a FOM trip (I think Dai is organising it) the same week as we're there.

Maybe see you there.

And if anyone does have any updates on which bivvy sites are open it would still be really handy. Thanks

[account_inactive]

Please don't settle for a bivi under any problems in the forest.  I've had the joy of British students asleep at 10am under my chosen problem.  This was all the more annoying as they had lit a fire and spread detritus all around.

I'm sure Neil will be along with advice on free stuff.  Why not stay at his place?

[neil h]

Please don't settle for a bivi under any problems in the forest.  I've had the joy of British students asleep at 10am under my chosen problem.  This was all the more annoying as they had lit a fire and spread detritus all around.

I'm sure Neil will be along with advice on free stuff.  Why not stay at his place?

lol, cheers Dylan, they could stay at my place but there is a 6 month waiting list

anyway, I was at the hippodrome yesterday, there are a few tents up, the bourron marlotte has always been the best one as there is running water. The police are on the case about people camping in the car parks at the moment, there has been a couple of murdered prostitutes over the last few weeks, also it has not rained here for so long and we have just had 10000 square meteres of forest burn down, so they are really clamping down on the car parks, big fines if you get caught, Apart from that not clued up to much on the bivi situation as have not used them for so long.

One place we bivi at a lot in the past is rocher potala, there are a load of houses built into the rocks that are pretty comfortable, you can light fores up there because there will be no one around as its 10 minutes from the car parks, but be warned also there has been a huge increase in the car break ins over the last few weeks, many of the car parks are closed because of the fire hazard so the gangs are really targeting the franchard hard, I know of 3 break ins this week from people in my gites.

So there you have it, be carefull, be aware and dont be stupid....

Enjoy, the temps are starting to drop now so chilly nights and mornings and lovely afternoons

[lukeyboy]

Thanks for the info guys. We're planning on BM but it's good to have a few back-ups. Can't wait to get to there I am psyched out of my mind....

[andy_e]

Where is the bivvy in BM?

[andy_e]

[lukeyboy]

Yeah I'm pretty sure that's right. Looking at the map, it's marked as a car park and is just at the edge of BM on the D58 north to font. There's only two in that sort of area and it's the more westerly of the two.

[lagerstarfish]

as an update - I noticed a few campervans parked outside Milly

turns out there is a free, official van park

http://www.campercontact.com/en/france/ile-de-france-75-77-78-91-92-93-94-95/milly-la-foret/25476/motorhome-parking-aire-municipale.aspx

could be useful

[SA Chris]

You can only use it if you have one or more dreads and one or more dogs on a string.

[kelvin]

Dreads? This is not Albarracin we're talking about.

[fried]

More retired couple with lap dogs.

[kelvin]

And satellite TV.

[fried]

And gardens with plastic fences and gnomes.

[tomtom]

Do the French have garden gnomes? If so - what's French for an ornamental garden gnome?

[cha1n]

as an update - I noticed a few campervans parked outside Milly

turns out there is a free, official van park

http://www.campercontact.com/en/france/ile-de-france-75-77-78-91-92-93-94-95/milly-la-foret/25476/motorhome-parking-aire-municipale.aspx

could be useful

Stayed in this occasionally a few years back. It's OK, it has water. It can be loud with youfs in the surrounding carpark. Sabot car park is better and Franchard even better still.

[joel182]

Do the French have garden gnomes? If so - what's French for an ornamental garden gnome?

A nain (=dwarf) de jardin, I think.

[rodma]

Sabot car park is better and Franchard even better still.

That's not very sound advice.

Stay at the official free sites or pay to stay somewhere else.

[boxmonkey]

There is free camping on the edge of the forest, near to the village of Bourron. The campsite has a toilet and a tap which is fast and fresh – excellent for drinking and for washing. Camping in the forest itself is forbidden, as I recall.

[cha1n]

That's not very sound advice.

Stay at the official free sites or pay to stay somewhere else.

Probably fair enough during peak times but when I was there (from late Jan) there was hardly anyone staying in the car park and it was fine. The rangers would drive through and tell anyone doing something silly like putting up a tent to take it down (yes this happened) but everyone staying in vans were left alone.

So long as you're responsible, it doesn't really make a difference. People sleep in their vans in the car parks of most crags in Europe. When you're on year-long road trips, staying on proper campsites is not affordable and the free ones are usually dodgy (lots of the aires in france are and you don't get them in Spain really but if you do they are also dodgy).

[rodma]

Don't get your point since there is a great spot at bouron marlotte.

Even when people are dossing in their vans, they tend to spill out a bit. I have a van too and happy to pay the few euros a night to stay at grez, otherwise I'd stay at bourron. When turning up at isatis car park I get easily wound up by setting people with their chairs, tables, stoves etc next to their vans, which take up at least an additional parking spot.

It only ever appears to be climbers dossing at the car parks for areas that are used by many people for many reasons. I think it looks shit and lazy.

Anyway, people will always do as they please and I guess it probably feels more like you're living the dream if you take a dump by the car park every day

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[cha1n]

Well I did say, not a problem if responsible, personally I never sat out at a table in the car parks but it's the people staying in the smaller vans that don't really have a choice on that front - I was in a motorhome.

When you say a few euros for the campsite, I assume you mean like 10euro minimum (absolute guess)? This soon adds up if you're in the forest for 3 months, as I was. And I was jobless, etc. I fully accept that people aren't going to like it when people are taking the piss and I witnessed it myself occasionally but so long as you're dealing with your waste properly, then I don't really see the problem. Staying in the forest shouldn't be limited to people who have the money to stay on campsites, gites and so on and to be fair, the free places aren't close to the best areas and fuel isn't cheap.

The one largers mentioned is close, but the nights we stayed there at the start of the trip we had groups of local youths playing their music loud until stupidly late (as it's on the edge of milly to nobody to complain). They also were loitering around the van, so I chose to go sleep with the other climbers in the car parks after that and all was good.

[dave]

Speaking from the perspective of someone going to font with a wife and kids, there are few things less appealing than rocking up to a carpark to find dozens of vans full of unwashed climbers in situ, knowing that each van equates to a good couple of kilos of turds produced per day, which are no doubt secreted either a short walk from the carpark, or at the crag. Some cunts at Sabots seem to think it's ok to lay your turd behind the boulders with the kid's circuits problems on, you know, right under the marked descents. Fucking lovely. But hey, if it saves them a few quid on their yearlong roadtrip (violins at the ready) then the rest of us will put up with it.

[rodma]

Well I did say, not a problem if responsible, personally I never sat out at a table in the car parks but it's the people staying in the smaller vans that don't really have a choice on that front - I was in a motorhome.

When you say a few euros for the campsite, I assume you mean like 10euro minimum (absolute guess)? This soon adds up if you're in the forest for 3 months, as I was. And I was jobless, etc. I fully accept that people aren't going to like it when people are taking the piss and I witnessed it myself occasionally but so long as you're dealing with your waste properly, then I don't really see the problem. Staying in the forest shouldn't be limited to people who have the money to stay on campsites, gites and so on and to be fair, the free places aren't close to the best areas and fuel isn't cheap.

The one largers mentioned is close, but the nights we stayed there at the start of the trip we had groups of local youths playing their music loud until stupidly late (as it's on the edge of milly to nobody to complain). They also were loitering around the van, so I chose to go sleep with the other climbers in the car parks after that and all was good.

You stayed near the climbing because it was convenient for you to do so.

When I was younger and spent a fair length of time there I just cut my trip short when the campsite money ran out. No big deal. That's life. Even back then I hated seeing people overnighting at the otherwise picturesque venues.

It's personal choice and I can see the appeal of sleeping right next to where you are going to be climbing, but these carparks are much nicer to drive into when they aren't populated with overnighters.

There's no doubt that what you did saved a little fuel and thus you were polluting a little less, which to me is the only positive, but as I said above, you could have parked somewhere more discreet and made your way to the climbing by other means.

[cha1n]

Yeh they are climbers, they're hardly going to rape your wife and kidnap your children, it's just a bit of dirt. People are shitting in that forest regardless of if they are staying in the car park, I doubt the people staying in the car park increase it by much, maybe just makes it more likely that it's going to be done before you arrive...

[Richie Crouch]

I don't even consider leaving the gite until I've swigged down enough coffee and scoffed enough pastries to force that satisfying 2nd  of the day!

[nai]

I'm not allowed to take the family to Isatis any more as my wife remembers it as the place with all the crusties, dogs, slacklines and shit everywhere.

Shame, I like Isatis.

[finbarrr]

i was so happy when they put up a high barrier at the isatis parking last year, at least the high campers couldn't get in anymore. i dislike people staying overnight at the parking areas, mostly because the locals and nature lovers hate it, and it is a reason to close parkings.
then the parking was nice and quiet and my car got broken into.
luckily they only took my toilet bag.

[rodma]

Chain, your presence there would have been detrimental to others, regardless of what a friendly bloke you might be.




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[fried]

I can understand you wanting to sleep in your van, but use a bit of imagination. There are plenty of spots to sleep for a night without using Isatis etc car park.

It's been talked about for years, but there are vague plans to turn the forest into a national park and reduce access to one or two large 'reception areas'. Be whiter than white, they maybe just giving you enough rope to hang us all.

[cha1n]

I personally think that it's tolerated in all but the high season, though I can see why people would be against it.

Had I not been travelling with my girlfriend then I'd probably stuck it out with the free ones out of principle but any car park in Font that has fast access via a main road has cars coming in and out all night, with what I can only assume is prostitute related business. You'd then pull up a Franchard and be told how quiet it was there every night and you can only resist that for so long.

I agree with the high barrier at Isatis, it was good for saving spaces for cars. Don't remember seeing lots of shit there but only had a couple of sessions there.

[rodma]

The one at bourron is fine, good, near climbing ( though clearly not near what you wantedl and prozzy free.

When on my long trip I bumped into a guy that was staying at grez and cycling everywhere. He was spending about 2euros a night ( cos he was in the bit described as the bivvy site ) on accommodation. Font is open to all, those that care about their impact , those on a really tight budget, those that can afford motorhomes, those that care about their impact, those that don't.

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[rodma]

Oh and tolerated by whom? I fucking hate seeing overnighters regardless of the time of year, as do others.

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[finbarrr]

I personally think that it's tolerated

yeah, tolerated and hated.

bourron is nice, personally i like the designated spot at the hippodrome de la sole better as it is further from the road, thus more quiet.

[lagerstarfish]

possibly of use...

from ONF site

http://www.onf.fr/enforet/fontainebleau/explorer/informations_pratiques/20120521-101448-15332/@@index.html

Camping et bivouacs :
un camping est situé au niveau du parking du Petit Barbeau, sur la commune de Samois-sur-Seine
deux sites de bivouac sommaire sont aussi à disposition : l'un à côté de la maison forestière de Bois-le-Roi (emplacement pour les tentes et point d'eau), l'autre à côté du parking de la Grande Vallée (emplacement pour les tentes, point d'eau et toilettes).

Points d'eau potable au niveau :
du parking de la Faisanderie de Fontainebleau
du centre d’écotourisme à Franchard (fontaine à eau et distributeurs de boissons à l’intérieur du centre)
du parking de Noisy-sur-Ecole
des deux bivouacs

[kelvin]

Nice one Lagers.

Fuck knows how I read that. Can't speak even English without sounding like a pigeon.

[lagerstarfish]

I was quite surprized by the number of vans and cars overnighting in the Croix Saint Jerome parking over the Easter fortnight given the proximity to several expensive looking houses.

[remus]

Oh and tolerated by whom? I fucking hate seeing overnighters regardless of the time of year, as do others.

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Why?

If someone is being otherwise responsible (not shitting in the woods, not littering etc.) what's wrong with staying overnight in a car park?

[cha1n]

Bottom line is that it's not permitted, regardless of how covert you're being.

I don't think it would be a problem if it wasn't for the fact that Font get's a lot of people using the forests for walking, cycling, horse riding and so on. Whilst the climbers know that us smelly hippies mean no harm, we still look like riff raff to the general public. Something I was reminded of every time I had to go into a supermarket whilst travelling, you sort of forget that you look like a homeless bum because so does everyone else you're around 95% of the time.

[Will Hunt]

you sort of forget that you look like a homeless bum because so does everyone else you're around 95% of the time.

Have you been to Font, Chain? It's like they hand out fluorescent trousers and posh tops in the car parks. Not sure what the gentlemen of the road wear around your way but I've never seen a homeless person wearing E9 strides.

[cha1n]

Ah yeh but that's the school holiday climbers. To be fair, I had some of the original, rust coloured E9s with me on my trip but they had holes in both ass cheeks, both knees and looked more of a chalky white/dirt colour most of the time.

[kelvin]

I have the 'yellow' E9 trousers and after a few days in Albarracin, they definitely say down and out hobo. Might last a few days more in Font but I'm not optimistic.
Obviously, if people are incensed by scruffiness, they won't go on to notice the attendant smell.

[fried]

You back this weekend?

[rodma]

Oh and tolerated by whom? I fucking hate seeing overnighters regardless of the time of year, as do others.

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Why?

If someone is being otherwise responsible (not shitting in the woods, not littering etc.) what's wrong with staying overnight in a car park?

Imagine you turn up on your own early in the morning at an otherwise deserted car park in the middle of the forest, in say an area well known for car break ins, and some fucker you've never set eyes on before is peering at you through their van Window as you get your shit together to go out climbing, walking or biking or whatever.

It's crap, lazy and unnecessary. It has fuck all to do with money.

I can understand how you ended up looking for somewhere safer to stay after your horrible sounding previous free spots and can see why you ended up where you did, but that doesn't make it a good choice and should definitely not be encouraged on a public forum you doofus. The parking is limited enough as it is and access is always a fragile beast, even when it appears to be a given.

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[kelvin]

You back this weekend?

I think Monday in all honesty - I'll message you my new number but have data also.
Mates arrive on Tuesday, plenty of psyche and pads around...

[kelvin]

Oh and tolerated by whom? I fucking hate seeing overnighters regardless of the time of year, as do others.

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Why?

If someone is being otherwise responsible (not shitting in the woods, not littering etc.) what's wrong with staying overnight in a car park?

Imagine you turn up on your own early in the morning at an otherwise deserted car park in the middle of the forest, in say an area well known for car break ins, and some fucker you've never set eyes on before is peering at you through their van Window as you get your shit together to go out climbing, walking or biking or whatever.

And I thought paranoia was the preserve of the weed smoking, dreadlocked dirtbags.
It's fair enough to think parking in the forest could affect access but to not like it because you're scared, intimidated or whatever is a poor argument against it.

It'd be really nice if people just listed places that were convenient, safe and a rough idea of cost and facilities - cos I keep hearing about places but having no French and often no internet fail to find them.

[rodma]

People complaining because overnighters intimidate them could easily affect access. I'm not saying that I was one of them :/

I agree that the thread really needs to get back on topic. Perhaps someone could split this drivel off into a logtopic

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[lagerstarfish]

from
http://www.camptocamp.org/summits/118197/en/foret-de-fontainebleau#authorized-bivouacs

Authorized bivouacs

Near the Forest-Hut of Bas-Bréau. Between Barbizon and Fontainebleau on N7, when you enter the forest after Barbizon. Water. Fires allowed after Ranger authorization. Closed.

Near the forest-Hut of Petit-Barbeau (close to the private camping), extreme northeast of the forest, close to the river Seine, north of the city of Samois-sur-Seine, at the entrence of the forest. Water. No fire allowed. Closed.

Near the Forest-Hut of Bois-le-Roi, on the south border of the city of Bois-le-Roi (north of Fontainebleau), at the entrance of the forest on N6. Water. Fires forbiden, gas stoves allowed.

Near the Forest-Hut of La Grande-Vallée, north of the city of Bourron-Marlotte (south of Fontainebleau on N7) when route D58 enters the forest. Water. No fireallowed, gas allowed. You must book for this one, probably many days before if you are a group. Should be OK if 2 or 3 climbers. Telephone of the Forest Hut where you will have specific infos on this bivy : +33/1-64-45-96-46. Address : Bivouac de La Grande Vallée, Maison Forestière de La Grande Vallée, 77780 Bourron-Marlotte, France.

Hippodrome de la Solle, just NW of Fontainebleau.

[kelvin]

Muchly appreciated both of you - as I'm gonna be in Font a month or so, the info really helps me out in the immediate future.
The free parking situation changes from month to month in all climbing areas, I'd assume Font to be no different, and being up to date isn't always easy. Living in a van full-time can mean you're in the know instantly or totally out of sink with an area in another country. I can happily answer questions about Suirana, Chulilla or Albarracin as it stands now but I've never spent much time in Font at all.