[T_B]

I generally really like Caff's sardonic sense of humour and his blog posts, but I cringed when reading this.

It's fair to discuss the issues around social media and sponsored climbers (espeically post Kindergate), but to say you effectively hate a company is unfair towards those who earn their livelihoods working for it. I know some very cool/hard working/impressive people who work for Rab and to suggest that a 'Company' is just those at the top of the tree is a bit naïve.

We've all been treated badly at some point in work//life. If you work in business you learn to be thick skinned. And there was me thinking Caff was a tough Cumbrian!

[36chambers]

And there was me thinking Caff was a tough Cumbrian!

Can't be that tough if he's trying to take an E9 tick for a measly E7

[petejh]

I generally really like Caff's sardonic sense of humour and his blog posts, but I cringed when reading this.

It's fair to discuss the issues around social media and sponsored climbers (espeically post Kindergate), but to say you effectively hate a company is unfair towards those who earn their livelihoods working for it. I know some very cool/hard working/impressive people who work for Rab and to suggest that a 'Company' is just those at the top of the tree is a bit naïve.

We've all been treated badly at some point in work//life. If you work in business you learn to be thick skinned. And there was me thinking Caff was a tough Cumbrian!

I think ‘because people earn their livelihoods from it’ is no justification for dodging criticism.

And if it was, then why shouldn’t that work both ways?

Surely a company and their staff should be thick-skinned enough to take a bit of banter from a load of ‘cyber wankers’ - like Caff in this case.

Just like climber x should be thick-skinned enough to get the elbow from Rab (which presumably would affect a climber’s livelihood to some extent).

[gme]

Interesting that Rab appear to be an utter cesspit of chuffs when it comes to sponsorship.

Rab is owned by a total ring piece who cares only for making money... can’t remember his name now but when I worked in the warehouse most thought him a total bellend. Made his first million selling those accessory krabs.

I never get comments like this.Is not the primary function of a business to make money?
I know a lot of business people and all to a one do it to make money. The level of what they want to make varies and effects how much or little they work but its all about money.
Doing this does not make you a bellend. He maybe a bellend for other reasons but not this.

[T_B]

I generally really like Caff's sardonic sense of humour and his blog posts, but I cringed when reading this.

It's fair to discuss the issues around social media and sponsored climbers (espeically post Kindergate), but to say you effectively hate a company is unfair towards those who earn their livelihoods working for it. I know some very cool/hard working/impressive people who work for Rab and to suggest that a 'Company' is just those at the top of the tree is a bit naïve.

We've all been treated badly at some point in work//life. If you work in business you learn to be thick skinned. And there was me thinking Caff was a tough Cumbrian!

I think ‘because people earn their livelihoods from it’ is no justification for dodging criticism.

And if it was, then why shouldn’t that work both ways?

Surely a company and their staff should be thick-skinned enough to take a bit of banter from a load of ‘cyber wankers’ - like Caff in this case.

Just like climber x should be thick-skinned enough to get the elbow from Rab (which presumably would affect a climber’s livelihood to some extent).

Being treated poorly by one or two individuals within an organisation doesn't mean you need to tar everyone with the same brush. People move around anyway. The implication is that the culture at Rab and the company is rotten, which I don't think's true nor fair.

But Rab as a company is successful, so they're an easy target and everyone just loves to jump on the bandwagon eh.

[T_B]

Interesting that Rab appear to be an utter cesspit of chuffs when it comes to sponsorship.

Rab is owned by a total ring piece who cares only for making money... can’t remember his name now but when I worked in the warehouse most thought him a total bellend. Made his first million selling those accessory krabs.

I never get comments like this.Is not the primary function of a business to make money?
I know a lot of business people and all to a one do it to make money. The level of what they want to make varies and effects how much or little they work but its all about money.
Doing this does not make you a bellend. He maybe a bellend for other reasons but not this.

Make money. Give people jobs and opportunities. Pay them more. How do business owners sleep at night?

[Duncan campbell]

What a twat

[petejh]

Make money. Give people jobs and opportunities. Pay them more. How do business owners sleep at night?

Inequality bed no doubt.

[DAVETHOMAS90]

I generally really like Caff's sardonic sense of humour and his blog posts, but I cringed when reading this.

It's fair to discuss the issues around social media and sponsored climbers (espeically post Kindergate), but to say you effectively hate a company is unfair towards those who earn their livelihoods working for it. I know some very cool/hard working/impressive people who work for Rab and to suggest that a 'Company' is just those at the top of the tree is a bit naïve.

We've all been treated badly at some point in work//life. If you work in business you learn to be thick skinned. And there was me thinking Caff was a tough Cumbrian!

I think ‘because people earn their livelihoods from it’ is no justification for dodging criticism.

And if it was, then why shouldn’t that work both ways?

Surely a company and their staff should be thick-skinned enough to take a bit of banter from a load of ‘cyber wankers’ - like Caff in this case.

Just like climber x should be thick-skinned enough to get the elbow from Rab (which presumably would affect a climber’s livelihood to some extent).

Being treated poorly by one or two individuals within an organisation doesn't mean you need to tar everyone with the same brush. People move around anyway. The implication is that the culture at Rab and the company is rotten, which I don't think's true nor fair.

But Rab as a company is successful, so they're an easy target and everyone just loves to jump on the bandwagon eh.

Very well balanced comments T_B.

+1

As you say, really important to remember all those involved.

As a separate point, for me, the suggestion that business is all about making money is a naive oversimplification.

Also have to applaud teestub for remaining good humoured 

Would be an amazing coup for both parties, if Caff and Rab could patch things up. I'll accuse myself off being naive before anyone else does.

[gme]

As a separate point, for me, the suggestion that business is all about making money is a naive oversimplification.

.

I did not say it was i said its the primary function and one that, in my reasonably broad experience, is what 99+% of businesses exist for.

If the owner of RAB was unethical, treated his staff very badly, ripped off customers, had a very bad environmental effect etc. and did so knowingly you could then justify him being called a bellend. To be called one because you made a business decision not to sponsor someone and HR maybe didnt handle it as well as they should, seems completely out of order to me.

I dont know anything about the issue that Caff is obviously upset about but i do know the reason why a business would chose to sponsor Andy Cave (just one i have picked off there website) and Caff despite the latter being a much better climber.

Image and audience is everything.

[DAVETHOMAS90]

GME.

My apologies if I've taken your comments out of context, or misrepresented them.

It wasn't a direct quote of you, because it was a reference to the common misconception that business is all about money and profit.

Dave.

[teestub]

Also have to applaud teestub for remaining good humoured 

Thanks Dave, little not to remain good humoured about, as Caff's blog has confirmed a large amount of the points I was trying to make.

[andy popp]

As far as I can tell from a Dixon FB post, Angus Kilelle (Sp?) has done The Indian Face. I think an ascent of IF will almost always remain significant.

[jshaw]

*Kille

[andy popp]

Apologies.

[Wood FT]

As far as I can tell from a Dixon FB post, Angus Kilelle (Sp?) has done The Indian Face. I think an ascent of IF will almost always remain significant.

Agreed

[Bradders]

Back on significant repeats, Becky Wilby has done Armed Response in Rocklands according to her Insta:

https://www.instagram.com/p/Bk5Or1RDixu/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=1jkm041gzdn8b

Klem Loskot classic with a bit of history behind it, seems to get 8A+ in some places and 8B in others. Regardless of grade, clearly a very hard bit of climbing. Pretty awesome in my opinion, just Shauna and Nia that I can think of operating at that sort of level from UK women atm.

[sxrxg]

The most "dark horse" couple in UK climbing? Font 8b+ for Sam and now font 8a+/b for Becky. Also not a sponsor between them as far as I can tell, just a genuine sike for training and climbing. Really inspiring.

[Doylo]

The most "dark horse" couple in UK climbing? Font 8b+ for Sam and now font 8a+/b for Becky. Also not a sponsor between them as far as I can tell, just a genuine sike for training and climbing. Really inspiring.

5.10 should dump Dave n Mina and give it all them.

[r-man]

The most "dark horse" couple in UK climbing? Font 8b+ for Sam and now font 8a+/b for Becky. Also not a sponsor between them as far as I can tell, just a genuine sike for training and climbing. Really inspiring.

Harder than that for Sam. He showed me some pics once of him climbing Misti in Font.

Top effort by Becky!

[monkey boy]

That is a seriously fine effort, Becky must have a great pair of shoulders! I don't know Becky but I think it's cool that she got on this where most are drawn to it's easier counter part Fragile Steps by lure of a bigger grade. Interestingly this was given 8B by Klem and then was downgraded due to someone climbing it that the guidebook author thought wasn't strong enough to climb 8B 

Also I think Misti is traverse 8c Robin so that would equate to 8B/+.

[monkey boy]

Aidan Roberts did Elephants Dawn (8B+) in Rocklands 3rd go yesterday

[remus]

Fuckin A. There's some hard problems in rocklands you look at and think 'maybe if i spent 2 yeard living under a board...' but Elephants Dawn isn't one of them. Gaskins style, no holds and a long way between them.

[teestub]

Aidan Roberts did Elephants Dawn (8B+) in Rocklands 3rd go yesterday

*Oliphant's Dawn

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlQzRk-F_pS/?utm_source=ig_web_copy_link

Reading through his other posted he's amassing quite a ticklist in a short time!

[fatneck]

Strong! Is he employing some kind of flying saucer to keep the sun off the holds?