[a dense loner]

you 2 get a room 

[petejh]

8c was first climbed in 1989

Is E9 not significant then - it was first done in 1986? Just asking

[gme]

Just to stir a the hornets nest Ben seems to have disturbed I agree with him. 
Having not seen any climbing media for years it amazes me that 8c routes  get as much written about them as they do. 
8c wasn't that big a deal 12-15 years ago. Normal climbers, including ones with a full time job, were doing them at the time and the top boys were in the nines. 
It equates to people doing 8a+/b back then which  Wouldn't have got a column inch. 
British media seems to not have moved forward at all in what is significant since I last climbed. 
e9 is a bit different as it's only a grade or so off the top level. And the trad grades seem more fucked up than ever.

[Doylo]

I agree. Its a brilliant personal achievement but not really significant in the scheme of things. Its becoming quite a regular occurence these days. I don't really mind it getting reported on the net though as i'm still interested and it gives me something to read on a dark lonely night. Plus i remember when the likes of Hickish and Barrows were punters so its cool to see the progression.

[Bonjoy]

The key point here is that this is a discussion thread, not the news section of a magazine. The bar is and should be set lower. Unlike column inches in a mag space is not limited here. 8c ascents are indeed common these days, far commoner than in the 90s infact (despite what misty eyed old timers will tell you). If we'd had t'interweb in the 90s people would have been reporting 8a+/8b repeats on threads like this. Why? Because it's just some old chat about people we know. It's not the bleedin' oscars is it.
Also folk are apt to forget that there's more to whether something is of news interest than the grade along. For instance has the route remained unrepeated for a long time, is the ascentionist especially old/young, have they got to a particular level exceptionally fast, did they climb the route whilst wearing a pig mask and farting the Bolivian national anthem?

[slackline]

...and at the same time there is a concurrent thread on How many brits have climbed 8c and above?. 

[Steamboat Stello]

The key point here is that this is a discussion thread, not the news section of a magazine. The bar is and should be set lower. Unlike column inches in a mag space is not limited here. 8c ascents are indeed common these days, far commoner than in the 90s infact (despite what misty eyed old timers will tell you). If we'd had t'interweb in the 90s people would have been reporting 8a+/8b repeats on threads like this. Why? Because it's just some old chat about people we know. It's not the bleedin' oscars is it.
Also folk are apt to forget that there's more to whether something is of news interest than the grade along. For instance has the route remained unrepeated for a long time, is the ascentionist especially old/young, have they got to a particular level exceptionally fast, did they climb the route whilst wearing a pig mask and farting the Bolivian national anthem?

I totally agree with the above, I never understand all this bullshit talk about the "climbing media", surely this is just a bunch of dudes (and girls) talking about climbing on a message board? Or have i missed the point? If some climbing someone has done is of significant interest to you and you think it might also be to someone else then it probably will be, whether thats on a world, national or local scale! If its not interesting for you then don't fucking read it, why do we need to have a clearly defined benchmark on what is/is not significant. Surely all were doing here anyway is wasting time between climbing sessions anyway!

[fatdoc]

 

The key point here is that this is a discussion thread, not the news section of a magazine. The bar is and should be set lower. Unlike column inches in a mag space is not limited here. 8c ascents are indeed common these days, far commoner than in the 90s infact (despite what misty eyed old timers will tell you). If we'd had t'interweb in the 90s people would have been reporting 8a+/8b repeats on threads like this. Why? Because it's just some old chat about people we know. It's not the bleedin' oscars is it.
Also folk are apt to forget that there's more to whether something is of news interest than the grade along. For instance has the route remained unrepeated for a long time, is the ascentionist especially old/young, have they got to a particular level exceptionally fast, did they climb the route whilst wearing a pig mask and farting the Bolivian national anthem?

besides I'm interested in what you good climbers do these days....

well done that man / girl.

[gme]

Is this not the part of a bigger climbing forum where" significant repeats" are reported, important climbing news and the likes. If I want to find out what members of our community are doing surely I would goto the yes yes fucking yes section. 
The fact that you say 8cs are done more often now is the same point i was making and surely makes them less significant as well therefore agreeing with my point. 
No Rose tinted specs either as I was not in anyway saying things were better 15 years ago just saying that 8c was more significant at the time. The first man on the top of Everest was significant!  The people who get dragged to the top now aren't ( to them maybe but not in the scheme of things.)
I agree with you re the description of significant, not just the grade is important. But surely Joe bloggs age 25 climbs 8c does not fall into this category.  Unless he was wearing said pigs mask and farting a little ditty. 

[Cassidy]

I almost feel embarrassed to reply to this having been someone who has been written about in relation to 8cs recently. (Note that UKC got that news from my blog and not through me pimping myself to them).   

Forgetting all that for a moment I agree with Bonjoy's sentiment completely though I can see the otherside of it too.  For one thing what level is significant in France or Spain is not really the same as it is here at the moment though the 8cs are rolling thick and fast now.  Perhaps that is the significant news.  Not that Joe Bloggs has done 8c but that UK sportclimbing has come out of its slumber and the pack are stepping up. 

Just because something was being done 10 or 12 or 30 years ago doesn't mean its not still significant today if it is a rare or fairly rare occurence.  Running 100m under 10seconds is still significant even though Bolt can do that while farting the bolivian national anthem.

If i want to read about truely significant world class ascents I don't turn straight to a forum thread but somewhere like 8a.nu or the like. I then come to find out about what's being going down on a more UK scale.  If significant is the hardest of the time and that alone then there is only one person to write about - Ondra.  But maybe its nice to hear about what other people do to? 
There seems to be a lot of picking on the routes climbers doing 8c, but we might also say that 8B boulders still get a nod and Fred Nicole put that grade out of date in 94 or something.

[Tim Broughtonshaw]

 

Agree with Alan's sentiments. Its good to hear about british achievements especially when many of our talented individuals look to have the potential to break into the premiere league echilon.  It we only heard about the top graded achievements then it would be pretty much ondra news ad infinitum. Which personally bores me. 

On that sentiment. See Chris Savage did progress @ Kilnsey today.       (i was supposed to be there today but skipped to do DIY  )

[Nike Air]

On that sentiment. See Chris Savage did progress @ Kilnsey today.       (i was supposed to be there today but skipped to do DIY  )

.

Wowee!! Good tick that. 

[shark]

(Note that UKC got that news from my blog and not through me pimping myself to them).   

If significant is the hardest of the time and that alone then there is only one person to write about - Ondra. 

And of course there is a thread for that

Good post Alan. The hierarchy seems to be established as: the YYFY thread, this thread, Creation of a separate News thread for something especially significant and then the Ondrawad thread  .

It's great that 8c ascents are becoming more frequent and still significant I think enough for this thread. It would be a shame if people became scared of posting interesting stuff for fear of being flamed for it not being'significant enough'. Maybe when Adam Lincoln bags his first one then perhaps it's time to downgrade 8c to the YYFY thread....

[account_inactive]

 

heard on the grapevine that Dan Varian repeated Superboc.

anyhting else happening in this nice weather?

It's funny that Ben started this thread by reporting the 5th ascent of an 8a..........

[carlisle slapper]

what a farce this has become. Not to mention how ignorant half these facts are. Bob is 21 and has been injured most of this year. I'd say thats worth a scant slither of a line on an internet topic where people have tried harder to write bigger sentences than the reporting one on the past few pages than bob probably did to saunter up true north.  I for one glean a modicum of inspiration whenever i hear that somebody else in the UK can be arsed getting out and up stuff and i'd say its a worthwhile sentence to read.

8B will be significant in the UK because its hard to climb it the lists in this forum prove as much escpecially if you got rid of parasellas and raventor. only 4 foreign people have ever climbed 8B bloc in the uk (caminati, nacho, bollinger,robinson) and they have been on our 2 most repeated 8Bs how many other countrys could boast such a nationalistic rebuff of foreign talent? its probably because the UK is so shit though to be fair, just a big steamy turd of choss. most 8Bs in the UK have had 5 ascents or less except for keen roof and loius armstrong (interesting) and the ace. Hubble was the first 8B, but was on a rope, (first 8B boulder was Isla i think)

Dylan, the 5th ascent of an 8A? why dont you just write the 90th ascent of a 7C? because it'd be just as erroneous (and therefore utterly pointless) as what you just wrote. Superboc hasnt even had 5 ascents yet and its been 3 years since that was written. Miles, Me (GU), Mike (GU), Bransby. And its rebuffed alot of other attempts and bloody broken Niges leg. So the very least you could do is make a vague effort to write something which is actually true. lovely to read that though boy i'm keen now... i'm off to do something shit and insignificant which isn't worth talking about (as always actually).

[dobbin]

Didnt win the rising sun quiz again then?

[nai]

if you got rid of parasellas and raventor. only 4 foreign people have ever climbed 8B bloc in the uk (caminati, nacho, bollinger,robinson)

Wasn't it a German fella that did the FA of Brad Pit sitter - Willenberg?

[account_inactive]

Dylan, the 5th ascent of an 8A? why dont you just write the 90th ascent of a 7C? because it'd be just as erroneous (and therefore utterly pointless) as what you just wrote. Superboc hasnt even had 5 ascents yet and its been 3 years since that was written. Miles, Me (GU), Mike (GU), Bransby. And its rebuffed alot of other attempts and bloody broken Niges leg. So the very least you could do is make a vague effort to write something which is actually true. lovely to read that though boy i'm keen now... i'm off to do something shit and insignificant which isn't worth talking about (as always actually).

All that deadhanging has cut off the oxygen to your brain Dan.  The point I was making is that you ascent WAS significant yet on paper it looked like it was only a repeat of an 8a.

EDIT: Just reading back through your rant Dan and wondered where I was misinformed, that I miss counted by 1 ascent? If you bother to look back further than a page on this thread you will see that it was I who was sticking up for the reporting of these things and jumping on my comment is a little short sighted when someone is backing you up.

[Cassidy]

Not sure if youve taken part of what i wrote the wrong way too Dan. I was not suggesting doing 8B was not significant, far from it. I was essentially making the exact same point as you are. A repeated 8B is very significant on UK terms just as an 8c send by Bob and I'm equally interested to hear about it.

[clgladiator]

I hope bob reads this and realises all the trouble he's caused, not content with breaking the cave, he had to go and do an 8c and make it insignificant 

[tim palmer]

Didnt win the rising sun quiz again then?

 

[carlisle slapper]

No quiz at all! just bored of this side of the peak scene sometimes.
My point was that whilst i'm with the arguments of the right honorable Bonjoy Cassidy and Dylan. Some of the reasoning was pretty poorly placed by offhand comments which, by being factually wrong, were less valid than bens original point.

Dylan: superboc is 8A+ my ascent was the second not the 5th and it was ground up (although ryan robbing himself on the last possible move was basically the second). I knew what you were trying to say but it is a poor way to make a point when every supporting fact you state is erroneous. Either that or you've just got a job alongside James Delingpole or christopher booker

Things are moving on in this country but sometimes the sheffield scene (which is where most of these argumentative posts are coming from) crops up to remind us of the 90's. yet like Alan said its only recently people have started sport climbing alot again in the UK. Look at it this way its taken over a decade for Malc, who made the most impressive young ascent of a hard route in the uk until Ondra's visits. To go from that ascent to 9a if you purely look at silly numbers (yet put up some amazing problems between then). McClure forged on through those dark ages and has left a load of hard routes to go at, (most of which were notable old projects or aid routes from those before him). nearly all of which except mutation and dreadnought (although this wont be long) have been repeated by someone now. A good sign that UK sport climbing is healthy and back on peoples radars. In the last decade people have been mostly bouldering hence why 8A isn't "significant" anymore when it certainly was back in the early 90s. Last winter more bloc 8s got put up and repeated than moon and moffats generation managed in a lifetime in the peak, but its thanks to them that we have some great problems to go at and to inspire us to find new ones.

Nai: brad pit sitter is reckoned to be 8a+ but very morpho. Sharik walker did SB-PUTP and superman, bock has done superman and garth miller flashed inertia reel. Those are all worth a mention too. As well as Marius (sp?) the strong pole who lived here for a bit and did lots of 8s on the bowderstone.

Edit, forgot Somehow Super of steves. and i guess batshadow if links are going in.

[TonyS]

Hi Dan,  not wanting to start anny arguments with anyone again, but I thouhght I'd pull you up on the comment bellow:

"Nai: brad pit sitter is reckoned to be 8a+ but very morpho."


What Mike siad at the time and what he still says is that the bottom part part of this problem, the moves from the ground into brad pit are 8a+ alone.

Then you have to do Brad pit as well, which ranges from 7c - 8a depending on your height and method.

Mike still says to folks, that to do the whole problem is at least 8b if not harder and is very Morpho

Cheers

Tony

[account_inactive]

Dylan: superboc is 8A+ my ascent was the second not the 5th and it was ground up (although ryan robbing himself on the last possible move was basically the second). I knew what you were trying to say but it is a poor way to make a point when every supporting fact you state is erroneous. Either that or you've just got a job alongside James Delingpole or Christopher Booker

My point is still valid despite getting the grade wrong by a + or the number of repetitions.  My point being the x repeats of an x boulder problem could be seen as not significant.  As you said you knew exactly what I meant but were being pedantic. It matters not one jot but what does matter is how you are being a dick about it. I don't think a couple of easy mistakes on an internet forum (about a problem I've not tried or a repetition list you can't qualify) can be compared with the likes of Delingpole or Christopher Booker (using capitals helps here).

Anyway good effort to people climbing 8c's and the like.  I like to hear about this sort of stuff to reaffirm how shit I am at climbing.

[T_B]

Step back from the grades. The whole point of this thread is in the name. If a route has already seen a lot of repeats (eg. True North), another one is not significant!

The repeat of a Birkett Scafell E8 (all of which are unrepeated) or I don't know, The Bastard (Rubicon)? That would be significant.

(It's Superbloc by the way).