[Yossarian]

The Turbo trainer....

I dug mine out the other day. 

It was hidden in the depths of my dungeon, behind the Rack and the Scavenger's Daughter, underneath the thumbscrews, brodequins, and cat'o'nine tails. 

A torture device so cruel, so painful it sends shivers of fear through the most experienced S&M aficionado.  Even David Mellor...

So, has anyone got any good workouts?

Not having the use of my projector and Tour DVDs at the moment, I have rediscovered all the techno mixes I downloaded on Houdini's recommendation last year.  I've been doing 20 - 25 mins at 95 - 100% TT pace.  I know I should be doing 2x 20mins, but I can't quite summon up the enthusiasm yet. 

Intervals are probably more interesting, but I think I might leave them till I get really bored. It's only November after all...

[webbo]

there is a book by pete read called turbo training to win.its probably had a couple of updates since i got mine 10 years ago,i can't recommend this enough if you do as he says it works.
so until you get hold of copy heres a couple of suggestions.given its november why are you training at race pace.its too early if you are planning to peak in march/april.
workouts upto christmas.
10 min w/up 25min 65%h/r 20min70%h/r 15min75%h/r 10min w/down.you increase the intensity of this the nearer you are to racing.
10 minw/up 5mins on 1min off x5(or as many as you can cope with) 10 minw/down i sually try to do this one around about 80% but usually end up with a higher  h/r
the above twice a week with a 3 hour or more ride at the w/e will get you in reasonable shape by christmas ready for some real work.
i.e.10 min w/up 1min 1min off x10 10 min w/down as hard you can with out blowing up.
10 min w/up 15 secs sprint 15 secs easy x3 1minrest then x5 1minrest x7 x9 x11 and back down 10 min warm down.
10 min w/up 1min 53x18 2 min 53x17 3min 53x16 4min 53x15 5min 53x14 6 min 53x13 7 min 53x12 10 min w/down.i can't remember on this one whether you get a minutes rest between each effort.
this following one was gieven to me by a coach who reconed the russian track squad used it.
warm up
45 secs t/t pace 15 secs sprint x4 5 min easy x 4 sets warm down.
enjoy

 

[fatkid2000]

I've never got round to buying one of these pain inducing machines - thought about it many times but always managed to find a reason not to. Anyway I'm thinking the time has come to get one especially as I am no longer able to commute to work. Anybody got any recommendations of what to get - it seems that like all bicycle equipment its possible to spend any sort of money.

[Yossarian]

I am training at race pace because I have been a very lazy boy and I am going mountain biking in three weeks time with some friends who are thinner than me and I don't want to get left behind I always get left behind, all on my own, cold and alone, people keep overtaking me and laughing at me on my expensive bike, it's all too much, someone make it end...

That's the gist of it.

[webbo]

in that case do one of the tempo sessions on a monday,beast yourself on a tues,wed and thurs.fri do a tempo session,sat beast yourself again.tootal outside on sun and repeat until you go.
you either be storming or fucked.

[Yossarian]

I've never got round to buying one of these pain inducing machines - thought about it many times but always managed to find a reason not to. Anyway I'm thinking the time has come to get one especially as I am no longer able to commute to work. Anybody got any recommendations of what to get - it seems that like all bicycle equipment its possible to spend any sort of money.

i have an elite mag trainer. not sure what the current version is called.

it's ok, as torture devices go.

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

[Yossarian]

there is a book by pete read called turbo training to win.its probably had a couple of updates since i got mine 10 years ago,i can't recommend this enough if you do as he says it works.
so until you get hold of copy heres a couple of suggestions.given its november why are you training at race pace.its too early if you are planning to peak in march/april.
workouts upto christmas.
10 min w/up 25min 65%h/r 20min70%h/r 15min75%h/r 10min w/down.you increase the intensity of this the nearer you are to racing.
10 minw/up 5mins on 1min off x5(or as many as you can cope with) 10 minw/down i sually try to do this one around about 80% but usually end up with a higher  h/r
the above twice a week with a 3 hour or more ride at the w/e will get you in reasonable shape by christmas ready for some real work.
i.e.10 min w/up 1min 1min off x10 10 min w/down as hard you can with out blowing up.
10 min w/up 15 secs sprint 15 secs easy x3 1minrest then x5 1minrest x7 x9 x11 and back down 10 min warm down.
10 min w/up 1min 53x18 2 min 53x17 3min 53x16 4min 53x15 5min 53x14 6 min 53x13 7 min 53x12 10 min w/down.i can't remember on this one whether you get a minutes rest between each effort.
this following one was gieven to me by a coach who reconed the russian track squad used it.
warm up
45 secs t/t pace 15 secs sprint x4 5 min easy x 4 sets warm down.
enjoy

 

btw - i assume those HRs are %ages of max HR?

[Bubba]

I think i've got one of these in the garage. I'm a bit scared to unleash it...

[webbo]

there is a book by pete read called turbo training to win.its probably had a couple of updates since i got mine 10 years ago,i can't recommend this enough if you do as he says it works.
so until you get hold of copy heres a couple of suggestions.given its november why are you training at race pace.its too early if you are planning to peak in march/april.
workouts upto christmas.
10 min w/up 25min 65%h/r 20min70%h/r 15min75%h/r 10min w/down.you increase the intensity of this the nearer you are to racing.
10 minw/up 5mins on 1min off x5(or as many as you can cope with) 10 minw/down i sually try to do this one around about 80% but usually end up with a higher  h/r
the above twice a week with a 3 hour or more ride at the w/e will get you in reasonable shape by christmas ready for some real work.
i.e.10 min w/up 1min 1min off x10 10 min w/down as hard you can with out blowing up.
10 min w/up 15 secs sprint 15 secs easy x3 1minrest then x5 1minrest x7 x9 x11 and back down 10 min warm down.
10 min w/up 1min 53x18 2 min 53x17 3min 53x16 4min 53x15 5min 53x14 6 min 53x13 7 min 53x12 10 min w/down.i can't remember on this one whether you get a minutes rest between each effort.
this following one was gieven to me by a coach who reconed the russian track squad used it.
warm up
45 secs t/t pace 15 secs sprint x4 5 min easy x 4 sets warm down.
enjoy

 

btw - i assume those HRs are %ages of max HR?

i'm a fraid so.
the problem with turbo trainers is there is no where to hide.you can't come out with all the usual shit of "its hilly or its windy or even the tarmacs melting" you've just got to knuckle down and get on with it.the only pleasure comes later when the effort pays off in races so its abit of a leap of faith.

[fatdoc]

I've never got round to buying one of these pain inducing machines - thought about it many times but always managed to find a reason not to. Anyway I'm thinking the time has come to get one especially as I am no longer able to commute to work. Anybody got any recommendations of what to get - it seems that like all bicycle equipment its possible to spend any sort of money.

i have an elite mag trainer. not sure what the current version is called.

it's ok, as torture devices go.

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

me too..

well. it's Dollys and he hates it so i robbed it off him last year..

as fatkid has *kindly* entered me into the cheshire cat (whilst I was off watching my brother get married)-  and entries are filling up pronto btw - ... i'd better get my lardy MTB arse onto the road bike... having just blundered off a plane after a 5 day whistle stop tour of singapore with temps of 32 degrees at midnight I'm really really loving the weather this afternoon.. weirdly i just dusted off the beast only 30 mins ago.. give it a another week of looking at my training log (incl cadance endurance training and up and down the cassette intervals... and at least one episode of passing out IIRC) and I'll have to strap the bike and me onto the damn thing  

[fatkid2000]

Fatdoc I was thinking of entering you for he 102 mile event - but thought better of it. I'm currently 'off games' having burnt my hand - don't ask, I can't drive let alone ride a bike. Anyway the garage is set and ready for torture, just need to get the machine to inflict this pain with - Can't wait!!!!

[Yossarian]

there is a book by pete read called turbo training to win.its probably had a couple of updates since i got mine 10 years ago,i can't recommend this enough if you do as he says it works.
so until you get hold of copy heres a couple of suggestions.given its november why are you training at race pace.its too early if you are planning to peak in march/april.
workouts upto christmas.
10 min w/up 25min 65%h/r 20min70%h/r 15min75%h/r 10min w/down.you increase the intensity of this the nearer you are to racing.
10 minw/up 5mins on 1min off x5(or as many as you can cope with) 10 minw/down i sually try to do this one around about 80% but usually end up with a higher  h/r
the above twice a week with a 3 hour or more ride at the w/e will get you in reasonable shape by christmas ready for some real work.
i.e.10 min w/up 1min 1min off x10 10 min w/down as hard you can with out blowing up.
10 min w/up 15 secs sprint 15 secs easy x3 1minrest then x5 1minrest x7 x9 x11 and back down 10 min warm down.
10 min w/up 1min 53x18 2 min 53x17 3min 53x16 4min 53x15 5min 53x14 6 min 53x13 7 min 53x12 10 min w/down.i can't remember on this one whether you get a minutes rest between each effort.
this following one was gieven to me by a coach who reconed the russian track squad used it.
warm up
45 secs t/t pace 15 secs sprint x4 5 min easy x 4 sets warm down.
enjoy

 

btw - i assume those HRs are %ages of max HR?

i'm a fraid so.
the problem with turbo trainers is there is no where to hide.you can't come out with all the usual shit of "its hilly or its windy or even the tarmacs melting" you've just got to knuckle down and get on with it.the only pleasure comes later when the effort pays off in races so its abit of a leap of faith.

ahhh, ok. i tend to work with percentage of threshold / TT pace.

this year i've got a lot better at beasting myself (when i actually bother to ride) - in my last pseudo competitive season (not terribly competitive, but hey) i discovered in retrospect that i had done far too many slow / gentle junk miles. 

i think a combination of a winter with longer rides and some turbo beastings, and then faster road ride in late jan / early feb will be the ticket. what for i'm not quite sure.

[Yossarian]

I've never got round to buying one of these pain inducing machines - thought about it many times but always managed to find a reason not to. Anyway I'm thinking the time has come to get one especially as I am no longer able to commute to work. Anybody got any recommendations of what to get - it seems that like all bicycle equipment its possible to spend any sort of money.

i have an elite mag trainer. not sure what the current version is called.

it's ok, as torture devices go.

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

me too..

well. it's Dollys and he hates it so i robbed it off him last year..

as fatkid has *kindly* entered me into the cheshire cat (whilst I was off watching my brother get married)-  and entries are filling up pronto btw - ... i'd better get my lardy MTB arse onto the road bike... having just blundered off a plane after a 5 day whistle stop tour of singapore with temps of 32 degrees at midnight I'm really really loving the weather this afternoon.. weirdly i just dusted off the beast only 30 mins ago.. give it a another week of looking at my training log (incl cadance endurance training and up and down the cassette intervals... and at least one episode of passing out IIRC) and I'll have to strap the bike and me onto the damn thing  

you're both riding this cat thing?

maybe i should join in...

[webbo]

ahhh, ok. i tend to work with percentage of threshold / TT pace.

this year i've got a lot better at beasting myself (when i actually bother to ride) - in my last pseudo competitive season (not terribly competitive, but hey) i discovered in retrospect that i had done far too many slow / gentle junk miles. 

i think a combination of a winter with longer rides and some turbo beastings, and then faster road ride in late jan / early feb will be the ticket. what for i'm not quite sure.

when i had my best results i actually cut down the amount of riding i did compared to my previous attempts to be a cyclist.in the old days i rode most days with little structure.
when i did the stuff i mentioned above.i would do some of the workouts on the road when it was light nights.i found doing the 5min 1 min off really good if you try ride at your t/t pace.also did the 1 min intervals of a very slight downhill.doing about 5 efforts starting in 53x16 and going up a gear each time then an easy pedal back to start.also did it going up the hill.i found these really helped with speed and power.
although i did long steady rides i didn't do that many or i would do some intervals then a couple of hours steady or ride along way round to a group training session.
you just need to workout what time you've got avalible and fit it in to a structure.interval training is hard but sometimes its alot easier to go out and do 30 mins of sprints than battle a block head wind for 2 hours on an easy ride.

[fatdoc]

I've never got round to buying one of these pain inducing machines - thought about it many times but always managed to find a reason not to. Anyway I'm thinking the time has come to get one especially as I am no longer able to commute to work. Anybody got any recommendations of what to get - it seems that like all bicycle equipment its possible to spend any sort of money.

i have an elite mag trainer. not sure what the current version is called.

it's ok, as torture devices go.

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

me too..

well. it's Dollys and he hates it so i robbed it off him last year..

as fatkid has *kindly* entered me into the cheshire cat (whilst I was off watching my brother get married)-  and entries are filling up pronto btw - ... i'd better get my lardy MTB arse onto the road bike... having just blundered off a plane after a 5 day whistle stop tour of singapore with temps of 32 degrees at midnight I'm really really loving the weather this afternoon.. weirdly i just dusted off the beast only 30 mins ago.. give it a another week of looking at my training log (incl cadance endurance training and up and down the cassette intervals... and at least one episode of passing out IIRC) and I'll have to strap the bike and me onto the damn thing  

you're both riding this cat thing?

maybe i should join in...

the cat... is the cheshire plain sportive... on the first day of british summer time.


my plan will be to set off with fatkid, and probs percy.... fatkid will zoom off into the distnace once he gets warm.. percy goes with the group that will try to chase the Kid down (and in all probablity fail)... i ride on my HR either with or without a group... fatkid gets to the front of the race.. sorry i mean sportive  and then gets lost 

i finish some considerable time later, by which time the kid and perc are already home in sheffield 

and a good time is has by all!!

the short course is not hilly, the long one isnt either, apart from some knee shredding 25% evil twat of a climb that i have no interest in getting off on...

[fatdoc]

scratch above, discussion of the Cat moved to the leg shavers thread... the course is not the same, by a long chalk...

[fatkid2000]

With the current freezing weather conditions and due to not being able to commute the torture by turbo has begun!!!

The only problem is boredom I manage about 30 mins before I get so bored - I have the ipod going full blast - disturbing my neighbours while I'm suffering. Anybody got any ideas for making it less boring.

I need to get some serious training time in, as I have a little holiday with doc in Spain which has 1500m of climbing a day on the MTB, then the Cheshire Cat long course. 

[webbo]

i don't know what your doing for your 30 mins on the turbo.but if you are just sat there pedaling for the time rather than doing a structured interval workout it will be boring.doing a structured session moves it away from boring to something like ritualised torture,which is alot more fun. 

[fatdoc]

I passed out twice last year    on a turbo

have to say after the life threatening nightmare that is my commute today  I'm going to start intervals on the short b*tard hills round the block from my house with singletrack descents through graves park for a crash fitness course for spain... i just cannt take  the turbo... MTB intervals twice a week here we come  . the climb is on road... and 500m only... but it's steeper than winnats 





BTW, we need a vomit smiley

[fatkid2000]

I passed out twice last year   on a turbo

How pathetic

have to say after the life threatening nightmare that is my commute today  I'm going to start intervals on the short b*tard hills round the block from my house with singletrack descents through graves park for a crash fitness course for spain... i just cannt take  the turbo... MTB intervals twice a week here we come  . the climb is on road... and 500m only... but it's steeper than winnats 

Then again - doing those roads through Dronfield - you must be mad & in the snow. I rode in to work & it was a f***ing mare but quicker than the car.

I'm doing intervals on le turbo - and god its dull, but needs to be done. This 1500m a day of ascent is mildly worrying.

[webbo]

I'm doing intervals on le turbo - and god its dull,

i would have never described turbo intervals as dull when i was doing them on a regular basis.more of a case this is going to hurt or have i got the determination to do it.are you sure your working hard enough.
i keep promising myself i will start turbo training again but currently i can't man up enough to get myself in the garage.

[Yossarian]

the only time i ever came close to actually enjoying turbo training (as opposed to basking in post auto-masochistic bliss, a la michael hutchence) was when i performed the activity in front of a large projection screen with the tour or the giro playing.  matching cadence was always quite a challenge. the only irritating bits were when it cut to a mini feature about french churches or a win a bike photo competition.

alas, now i only have a not quite cold enough garage and an ipod. 

i would dearly love an SRM ergometer. now that's a cruel machine...

[webbo]

i have been shamed in to getting back on the turbo, 2 sessions in last 2 days.this is a result of when i called round to my mate mikes on sat at 10.00 am to go climbing,i enquired as to where his girlfriend emma ( a triathlete) was.she was on the turbo trainer where she'd been since 7.00 am,she couldn't go out on the roads as it was too icy.
she was still going strong when we left at 10.30.

[fatkid2000]

That deserves some respect. I managed one and half hours yesterday evening - but over 3 that's amazing.

[Norton Sharley]

 

why?

 

[SteveM]

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

And only £152 on wiggle this morning. Anyone got any dissenting views before I part with hard earned cash?

[fatkid2000]

if i was getting one now i'd buy the cycleops fluid trainer, mainly cos it looks much better made and has a much heavier flywheel.  i think that's the key thing that makes a trainer more realistic.

And only £152 on wiggle this morning. Anyone got any dissenting views before I part with hard earned cash?

I got one a few weeks ago from Mr wiggle - and it seems fine to me. Really easy to use & just wait to see how much your bike frame flexes when into it.

[SteveM]

That's sealed the deal, I'm logging onto Wiggle right now before I change my mind.

[Percy B]

First session tonight - intervals for 30 minutes. Made me feel quite sick! Its quite an experience turbo trainning with a track bike on the turbo instead of a bike with gears. You have to maintain a very high cadence with no escape into the bigger gears. Maybe we should have a challenge to see how hot you can get your turbo - mine was pretty damn warm when I packed it away!

[fatkid2000]

Saturday morning starting at 6, I did a 2 hour session - felt rather shite for the rest of the day, but recovered enough by Sunday for a bit of MTBing. Sounds interesting using a track bike - nowhere to hide with gears etc.

[Yossarian]

have any of the recent cyclops purchasers got any feedback about how wonderful / evil their new toys are?

i did some proper intervals tonight, rather than steady state. it was a bit of an epiphany.  rather then spending 20 - 30 minutes wishing the clock would speed up a bit, i instead found myself willing the minutes in between the intervals to slow down. the painful bits were quite horrid though...

[fatkid2000]

Evil machine - is all I can say, did a quick half hour after work - it was minus 2 and I was still caked in sweat at the end.

 

[SteveM]

The machine's fab. What it does to me is evil 

Wiggle sent a free race dvd along with it that includes a warmup, recording of an actual race and warm-down sections which proved a decent distraction from the lack of variety in the scenery. I was only on the bike for 30 mins but it felt like a lot longer and like fatkid I was drenched afterwards. Had to have a shower and everything. Going to try for the full 40min race simulation later this week...

[Yossarian]

Along the same lines, I went to the lab for some testing this morning. Nothing beats a bit of science and I love a little prick in the hand from time to time. If a turbo trainer is torture then the srm ergometer is like a week with usay hussein armed with some handcuffs and a hammer drill.

[chappers]

so...i went out with the manchester wheelers on sunday.
i am not exaggerating when i say it is the most miserable time i have ever had on a bike. it was VERY cold and very windy. my hands were too cold to open the packets of any food, so, by the time i was at the top of the cat and fiddle i had the knock, fully. tried to keep on for the rest of the ride but got dropped. horrible experience.
i have lost alot of my fitness, very fast from too long off the bike (3 months).

as a result, today i bought a tacx turbo trainer.
what should i do? (i have about 2 months to get it back before the cheshire cat!). i want to build it up slow to start...

Along the same lines, I went to the lab for some testing this morning. Nothing beats a bit of science and I love a little prick in the hand from time to time. If a turbo trainer is torture then the srm ergometer is like a week with usay hussein armed with some handcuffs and a hammer drill.

i have been through the same process in november, only got the results this week due to email fuck up. i love all that science stuff - shame my results no longer apply to me since i am now weak!

i need to get this back:

"Observations

Body composition was assessed using air plethysmography.  This yielded a %BF of 6.40% , which would place you within the lean category based on normative values.  Lean body mass was 93.60%.

VO2max was 69.89 mL.kg.min-1 indicating excellent aerobic capacity (average for healthy males is between 42 – 50 mL.kg.min-1).

Blood analysis revealed haemoglobin (Hb) levels of 10.5 mmol.L.  This variable is very age and sex dependent, but values obtained during testing are at the upper end of what is thought to be normal for males of your age (8.37 – 10.8 mmol.L). As Hb is the compound that oxygen binds to, this would indicate a high potential to utilise oxygen. This is also reflected in the VO2max value obtained.  Haematocrit (Hct) reflects the percentage of whole blood packed with red blood cells. Analysis of Hct found your Hct to be 47.0 %.  This again is within the normal acceptable range for men (40 – 54 %). 

Maximal aerobic power output averaged over the final minute of the test was 323 watts. Again this is comparable with highly trained cyclists."

[Yossarian]

How much did you weigh when you had that test?

[Yossarian]

my lab test revealed that my plan (as mentioned further back in the thread) to get fit as fast as possible by concentrating entirely on beasting myself has had some curious results.

my max minute power is down 50ish watts from where it was when i was fit before. i am generally less fit and my economy is pretty rubbish. however, my hypocapnic hyperventilation parameter "exceeds that of a professional cyclist". my vo2 max has improved too.

i have been prescribed a load of level two riding.  as webbo pointed out at the time, concentrating on top end riding with no base is not a terribly good way of going about it. so i'm doing about 5 weeks of long steady rides and turbo sessions, adding some intervals in again in maybe 3 weeks time, and then stepping it up again. 

apparently it's still really important to continue to include level two riding even when you're building and peaking.  something i've not considered before. level two plus level three/four gets you fitter than solely the latter.

[chappers]

How much did you weigh when you had that test?

i was 65.9 kg.

4.2 kg fat, 61.7 lean.

my plan is to do long sessions (1hr ish) on the turbo at medium intensity for a while, then start to introduce intervals.

my main problem is i feel really fit in my lungs and heart, but my legs are sluggish and i get the knock easy because i have so little stored energy.

[jordysi]

have been "playing" on my turbo since getting a chest infection in November and not getting out, do about an hour ten to an hour twenty, use a heart rate monitor, and am now finding i can measure performance not only in time and heart rate but diameter of sweat puddle on the floor, currently managing about 3 foot 4 inches can anyone beat this, is it good where do I stand in the pain vs fitness stakes?

[webbo]

but where is your turbo.if you've got in the kitchen your going to sweat more than in the garage.i mop myself with a towel and also have a thing to stop the sweat landing on my bike.
a better measure would be the difference in the weight of your shorts i.e.before and after but no pissing youself allowed.