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What would be the ultimate board? (Read 17505 times)

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What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 07:49:26 pm
So if you had the space to put in an awesome board and training facility what would you go for?

I would probably put in a 50 degree board (as long and as wide as possible)
Campus/finger/Systems board
Rings
Weight bench

I'd not sure if it would be worth putting in a 30 degree board or trying to get all fancy with changes of angles............what do you beasts think?

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#1 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 08:12:49 pm
Very interesting topic Dylan... I'm interested to hear what people have to say...

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#2 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 08:45:04 pm
Something like the board at Broughton...but more of it and a bit higher.

nik at work

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#3 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 08:52:04 pm
The Climbing Works.

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#4 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 08:54:38 pm
An exact replica of Keith's board.

No scratch that.

An exact replica of Keith's naked torso, tilted at 50 degrees. Problems finish by kissing his forehead.

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#5 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 09:42:51 pm
The Climbing Works.

 :lol: :lol: :lol:

An exact replica of Keith's board.

No scratch that.

An exact replica of Keith's naked torso, tilted at 50 degrees. Problems finish by kissing his forehead.

Well, only a select few have scaled that surface, and I'm upset to say you're not one of them! Why didn't we ever physicalise our love?

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#6 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 08, 2008, 10:23:12 pm
Not sure about all the funky angles either....  Just look at BoulderUK. I am not sure you get all that beastly strong you just develop good technique and good at doing comp style problems. Do people agree?

I think as big a 50 board as you can fit in. rings, campus, weights/bench, yes yes yes....

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#7 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 12:55:41 am
So if you had the space to put in an awesome board and training facility what would you go for?

I would probably put in a 50 degree board (as long and as wide as possible)
Campus/finger/Systems board
Rings
Weight bench

I'd not sure if it would be worth putting in a 30 degree board or trying to get all fancy with changes of angles............what do you beasts think?

You know what i'm going to say here:



50' - With the right combo of holds you can train raw power better than any other way I've personally found.
30' - General climbing at this angle seems to translate better to actual gains, i.e. you can put the above into practice
15' Crag X - Single handedly the best way I've ever found to improve finger and contact strength.

A lot of the above depends on hold selection.

Weights Bench that goes from fully inclined to decline.
Rings with pulley
Campus Board
Bar with pulley
Fingerboard

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#8 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 01:03:11 am
The Climbing Works.

I really do hope that was a joke. Did anyone notice a marked improvement this winter after thrutch humping volumes? I get disappointed every time I go down the place (mainly on spotting duty these days), it could have been the ULTIMATE venue...

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#9 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 07:59:38 am
Yes, I went there two or three times this winter and have noticed a considerable improvement in my humping technique. I can now no longer walk past a skip without quickly nipping up its arete  ;)

I suppose it depends what you're using it for, The Works is a good venue for me because it suites the climbing I do, I never really climb 50' walls so these are less useful to me.

My ideal wall would be a big boulder in my garden. I'd have a big umbrella over it, so I could let it get wet on days I didn't want to climb it. It'd have various holds and cracks on it and some big dynoes. It'd have a really good problem up the back of it, which would always have a human turd with toilet paper stuck in it at the bottom. I wouldn't let anyone else climb there but I'd get the rumour machine going that there was a fb8c+ traverse on it. It would be made of five different rock types and have a plaque to my grandad on it.

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#10 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 08:45:45 am

I suppose it depends what you're using it for, The Works is a good venue for me because it suites the climbing I do, I never really climb 50' walls so these are less useful to me.


You don't need to be climbing 50' problems outdoors to gain from a board at that angle

I knew exactly what you were going to say Paul :)  But if you had the chance to build the school again would you do it exactly the same?  I'm not denying that it's the best training facility out there but could it not be improved on?

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#11 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 09:43:16 am
The Climbing Works.

I really do hope that was a joke. Did anyone notice a marked improvement this winter after thrutch humping volumes? I get disappointed every time I go down the place (mainly on spotting duty these days), it could have been the ULTIMATE venue...
I think that we would be looking for different things from our boards Paul. You strike me as an incredibly focused person who takes a scientific approach to improving their climbing by creating specific goals, strategising training and diet regimes to realise these goals, assessing and adjusting these regime to realise further specific goals. You obviously have the drive to stick to these training patterns and it has served you well (8b+ or whatever it is). I absolutely respect your approach to training and climbing. However...

...I'm more of a dick about a bit and have a laugh person. A huge flat 50 would bore me so I wouldn't use it whereas the works would have me running round like a kid at christmas. I'm envious of your ability to focus, but I do enjoy pratting about.

So yes it was a serious suggestion as the ultimate training facility for me.

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#12 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 10:24:23 am
What about the kickboard on the 50 degree Paul?  Would you reduce the size of it or keep it as is?

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#13 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 10:44:36 am
The Climbing Works.

I really do hope that was a joke. Did anyone notice a marked improvement this winter after thrutch humping volumes? I get disappointed every time I go down the place (mainly on spotting duty these days), it could have been the ULTIMATE venue...
I think that we would be looking for different things from our boards Paul. You strike me as an incredibly focused person who takes a scientific approach to improving their climbing by creating specific goals, strategising training and diet regimes to realise these goals, assessing and adjusting these regime to realise further specific goals. You obviously have the drive to stick to these training patterns and it has served you well (8b+ or whatever it is). I absolutely respect your approach to training and climbing. However...

...I'm more of a dick about a bit and have a laugh person. A huge flat 50 would bore me so I wouldn't use it whereas the works would have me running round like a kid at christmas. I'm envious of your ability to focus, but I do enjoy pratting about.

So yes it was a serious suggestion as the ultimate training facility for me.

I mean absolutely no offence to Nik, because you are completely correct in your assesment of the fact that different people put in/get out different things from climbing. However, the word training necessitates a focused approach, otherwise you aren't training, you're "pratting about". Please understand that I am not making ANY sort of judgement about which has greater worth, as I think that both are equally useless.  ;)

I think that an ultimate training venue, by definition, would allow people to MAXIMISE their return on their allotted input to training for climbing. Any bouldering wall can set some fun problems and you can go there to have fun and climb, but this is not training. There is a big difference, and I can see that you also see that. This is the difference between the works and the school. This is why there is a growing number of people who would rather use a small dusty room than a huge, varied, bouldering wall.

I also don't mean to disrespect anyone else on UKB or anyone else for that matter by saying that the majority of climbers do not train. I use the word "train" as I see it used in other professional sports. You might disagree with that use of the word, but I think this is relevant to Dylan's original question. He wants to have a training venue, where he can hone his skills at rock climbing. He wants to be able to maximise his inputs to get the greatest possible gains and outputs. I am not starting a debate on what the best training for climbing is, but a clue would lie in the assessment of how the top climbers (I am only referring to boulderers in this context) got to where they are. Daniel Woods, Tyler Landman, Killian Fishburger, John Gaskins, etc. My point, sorry for the delay, is that a training board should be a training board. It should not have to be fun, or interesting, or quirky, or colourful, it should only serve one purpose, to improve your climbing specific skill set in the most efficient way.


Dylan, regarding a kickboard. A kickboard should be kept smaller in my opinion, it's only utility is in enabling the use of smaller holds on the bottom of the board (by having better footholds on vertical wall) and to make sit starts a little easier. I think a 12" kickboard is enough although given enough room an 18" one would be good too. It all depends on the length of the board I guess.


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#14 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:00:28 am
i don't think you can really equate climbing training at present to training for top-level at other sports - its nowhere near advanced. However I would guess that taking climbing training to the equivalent of other sports would be seriously tedious and boring and you'd have to basically mortgage all your climbing enjoyment over a period of years to maybe do just one single problem at your theoretical maximum.

the school board is great but could be improved - for a start if you were really serious you'd have the board then have an exact mirror-image of it to prevent you subconciously favouring one half of your body. you'd also have a system board, maybe 45 degrees. the 35degree board idealy would be about twice as wide.

also, has anyone actually got out a protractor and spirit level and measured the angle of the school board recently? it feels a lot steeper than my old 45 cellar board was, and given the fact its held up by a slender strand of bootlace I would wager than it's probably sagged over the years and might actually be a lot steeper now.

P.S. this winter i found the "training board" at the works to be quite good and enjoyable, though still limited ultimatley.

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#15 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:01:59 am
Quote
He wants to have a training board, where he can hone his skills at climbing

Bad choice of words here, to me this is in direct contradiction of the rest of your post. A training board (certainly at 50 degrees) primarily increases your strength for climbing. I have seen precious little evidence that it increases anyone's skills at climbing.

I'd agree with Dave that a mirror board with no ticks until both ticked must be part of a serious training set up.

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#16 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:03:28 am
You are, of course, correct JB. I should have written "skill set" instead, as I did further along my post. Thanks for clarifying what I meant!

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#17 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:10:07 am
Worth mentioning that if you do want to improve your skills at climbing, pratting about is almost certainly the best way. Anyone else onsighted E8 here? No? Just Nik?

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#18 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:15:19 am
Nope, but I have onsighted 7c routes, which means my physical skill set should be equal to that of Niks, but my "mental skill set" is FAR, FAR, FAR below and I don't think I know of any indoor wall where you can train to improve those skills!

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#19 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:17:38 am
Quote
Bad choice of words here, to me this is in direct contradiction of the rest of your post. A training board (certainly at 50 degrees) primarily increases your strength for climbing. I have seen precious little evidence that it increases anyone's skills at climbing.

It will obviously transfer to the skills on a 50 degree wall outside with similar holds

A symetrical board like the Varian/Ned variety sounds like a good idea

Training for technique is a waste of time indoors IMO unless you want to get good at comps.  I have the Peak on my backdoor so I climb outside as much as possible. 

As Uncle pointed out a board will give you maximum strength returns for the amount of time and effort invested

The Works/Foundry have great walls that I would climb at to try other peoples problems and of course to socialise

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#20 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 11:18:22 am
Uncle I agree with everything you said. I suppose ultimately what I'm saying is that training in its purest form isn't for me, so constructing what would objectively be the "best" facility would be wasted on me. However I would still see gains in my climbing if I had the climbing works in my (fucking enormous) theoretical cellar. Yes I could have greater potential gains from having the school down there instead, but as I'd rarely use it and certainly not in any structured way the gains would remain potential only. So for me the works is the better option. I suspect I'm not the person Dylan was directing the question at. :)

 I also fully accept your point that I don't train. Perhaps I practice rather than train and the works is the ultimate practice wall?

However anybody claiming the works is just volume humping is presenting a very skewed (and dare I say innacurate) view. OK the system board bit might not be as steep or large as some people want but the place does offer a huge area of climbing, and a huge variety of climbing styles. Including volume humping, but also slabs, roofs, crimps, slopers, walls etc etc etc.

That last paragraph isn't directed at you particularly Uncle, just a general comment.

P.S. No offence taken at all, I'm very happy to be known as someone who largely dicks about and hasn't the faintest idea about training.

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#21 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 12:18:47 pm
An exact replica of Keith's naked torso, tilted at 50 degrees. Problems finish by kissing his forehead.

I'm scared by what the starting holds might be.

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#22 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 12:26:44 pm
Surely you guys are missing the point?  Ideal board would be pretty good for training on for a couple of hours whilst listening to banging tunes, nice sofas to recline on, beer fridge / wine cooler for afters, a wine rack and one of those old fashioned ash trays with the spinny top to cover up the evidence.  And maybe a little portable mirror.  8)

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#23 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 12:41:48 pm
strength for climbing ... skills at climbing. ...

Dammit, I was going to reply after reading Unc's post and suggest that Johnny Brown would now be summoned into this thread for exactly that reason....ah, you snooze you lose...

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#24 Re: What would be the ultimate board?
July 09, 2008, 01:54:06 pm
However anybody claiming the works is just volume humping is presenting a very skewed (and dare I say innacurate) view. OK the system board bit might not be as steep or large as some people want but the place does offer a huge area of climbing, and a huge variety of climbing styles. Including volume humping, but also slabs, roofs, crimps, slopers, walls etc etc etc.

Ok so its got more than just volumes but its severely lacking in a lot of areas anyone who denies this is blinkered. I just typed a whole list of things but decided that the thread probably shouldn't go down that route.

Nik - You might have been very surprised at just how good some of the problems were on that board and i'm (hopefully) not as serious as you think.

Dylan - I think Uncle answered your question for me, if the kickboard wasn't that high then some of the smaller holds at the bottom of the board would be defunct.
Preferably i'd move it away from the wall and plaster the moonboard in those big pusher slap tiles...Red one ahem?  :spank: I'd also probably try to avoid resting notched beams on glued-on cornice's.

JB - We always have this discussion. It translates well to Limestone and sport.

Dave - Yes I measured it recently and its pretty accurate considering its age and the lack of support at the left hand top corner.



 

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