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What do I need to train? (Read 900 times)

bedrock

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What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 09:05:58 am
female climber that at my best can boulder 7a outdoors in a few worked sessions. However whilst I know how to work my finger strength I'm struggling with one thing in my climbing - and thats final moves. What always lets me down is not normally the hardest move on the problem, but the ability to do the last move. I just seem to lack ooomph. I usually do the final moves of the problem in isolation, but when it comes to linking with the rest of the problem I just cant!!
 What I don't know is what I need to train to improve this? Any ideas, tips etc. Have access to beastmaker2, weights and moonboard. Thanks in advance


jwi

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#1 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 09:33:00 am
Hard to access without more information, but I'll give it a shot anyway (talking out of my...)

Beginner-intermediate routesetters finish every boulderproblem with a long move to a jug, so I will assume that the boulders you struggle to finish are around 6-8 moves long with a hard first move and a morpho last move (so the last move may be easy or hard depending on your stature). The most likely cause of consistently failing on the last move is either physiological (you're falling at the 25-30s mark because your anaerobic lactic metabolism is not powerful enough you can only do the move using a far amount of the most powerful muscle-cells which prefer the ATP-PC system, which will not be available after ~10-15s of climbing) or mental, but the training to correct the problem is the same anyway.

Do the following 1.5-2 x week for 8 weeks: 35 X [4-6 X 2-3 move] ; r:10s, R=3min.
(A set/work-unit consist of selecting one boulderproblems of 2-3 moves and repeat it 4-6 times with ten second of rest between each repetition. Rest 3 minutes between each set and do 3-5 sets). The problems should be fairly hard but not maximal, you should not get pumped so stay within 15 moves for each work unit. You should only fail on the last or second to last 2-3 move problem on the last set. You should fall because you power-out (not because you are pumped). Make every rep count.

After this exercise you will not be able to do any high-quality training, so do it after short bouldering if you combine it with something else. After this you can do easy traversing etc.
 
[Since I haven't seen you climb this might be bull, but hey it's free advice so basically worthless  ;) ]

tomtom

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#2 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 10:03:47 am
I find I often power out on the last couple of moves. I have poor stamina - if I'm on a problem for more than 45 secs I'm done (just as well I only boulder!)

There's a great answer above - but I'd suggest just work your weakness - find a wall problem that you can only 'just' do - or can really nearly do (with a tricksy last move) and repeat it - work it over a few sessions.

It may also be that the crux moves lower down are close to the limit - so you over crimp/pull etc.. leaving you powered out until the end...

Or just find shorter problems :) (that my usual plan!!)

SA Chris

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#3 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 11:09:24 am
Work it top down? Get the final moves wired, then work up to them from lower and lower down? Or is that seen as too old school thees days?

jwi

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#4 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 11:17:12 am
I humbly disagree. With lots of caveats... But if the problem is that you (& she) power out on stuff around the 45s mark (or 30s mark) less intensive methods are (likely) needed. If you want to work problems at the 45s mark to get better on the last bit of them the intensity has to be adapted so that you actually spend some time training the quality you want to improve.

An alternative to what I suggested could be to do 2-3 X [2-4 X 8-15 moves] : r 3min, R 8min. Set 2-3 8-15 moves problems (you probably have to set them yourself especially at the longer end) and do each problem 2-4 times with 3 min rest between the repetition. Rest 8 min (complete rest) before changing the problem. Again, only start to fail on the last two attempt on the last set. As a route climber I don't really like this way of training this quality (if I'm in shape) since it is too hard to set the right level (either I can't do the problems or I can do them every time until the sun goes into nova) but I've seen it work quite well for people who mostly boulder.

jwi

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#5 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 11:20:39 am
Also bring a stop-watch to check that the problems actually take 45s to climb, and not 25s. Might be a problem if you set circuits on a small wall (with lots of handmoves from a single foot-hold you can do one move per second)

Dexter

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#6 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 11:34:44 am
climb fasterTM

Murph

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#7 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 11:55:20 am
Good advice from others here. My 2p, having been through this process and wishing I'd done something differently...

I usually do the final moves of the problem in isolation, but when it comes to linking with the rest of the problem I just cant!!

How many moves to the last move? Could be a stamina or a psychological issue. Long term solution to this is to get fitter and more confident.

Short term solution is to forget about the start. The start doesn't matter. What matters is that last move. Get it utterly wired. So wired there is almost no chance you fail it. You want to be able to do laps on it. And do it quickly and efficiently. "Usually" has no place in last non-crux moves of limit boulder problems. You want to be able to do it every time.

Then go from the bottom.

Do not go from the bottom until you have that top wired.

What problem is it?

SA Chris

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#8 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 12:10:51 pm
What problem is it?

I assumed it was indoor problems and a general issue. If not, train as per above on indoor problems.

Murph

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#9 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 12:30:45 pm
Oh. Thats a lot less interesting then. I didn't read thoroughly - just automatically assumed it was a lifetime project.


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nai

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#10 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 02:05:41 pm
What problem is it?
I assumed it was indoor problems and a general issue.

Not necessarily:
at my best can boulder 7a outdoors in a few worked sessions

but it does sound like a general issue rather than a specific problem, possibly when trying harder stuff than 7a?

andy_e

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#11 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 02:07:45 pm
Yes, a general case of lastmoveitis is what I assumed from the OP.

tomtom

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#12 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 03:51:12 pm
Oh I'm quite happy failing at 45 secs...

I'd much rather train for strength than endurance... time is too short and I get bored very quickly :) only every now and then do I get sucked into some >45 secs endurance fest ;)

andy_e

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#13 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 04:10:14 pm
At least you're not like shark, where even one-move problems take > 45 s...

tomtom

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#14 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 04:14:29 pm
At least you're not like shark, where even one-move problems take > 45 s...

I'm glad the climbfaster (tm) message is spreading :)

(apologies to the OP as the thread veers off topic...)

Oldmanmatt

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#15 What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 04:28:39 pm
At least you're not like shark, where even one-move problems take > 45 s...

I'm glad the climbfaster (tm) message is spreading :)

(apologies to the OP as the thread veers off topic...)
Shouldn't that be TTTM?
(Honestly, we're worse than a bunch of ADHD Schizophrenics)

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tomtom

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#16 Re: What do I need to train?
August 08, 2017, 04:32:45 pm
At least you're not like shark, where even one-move problems take > 45 s...

I'm glad the climbfaster (tm) message is spreading :)

(apologies to the OP as the thread veers off topic...)
Shouldn't that be TTTM?


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