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BMC No Confidence Motion (split from the Why aren't you a BMC member? thread) (Read 72260 times)

Will Hunt

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Has the wording of the no confidence motion been made public? I don't want to be a tease but somebody handed it to me today (they'd seen it through their club I think). I can post up here if it's of interest to people but no idea if it's confidential or not. I suppose if you're going to table a motion you have to expect that people might read it?

Offwidth

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I'm sure many people would like to know if you think it has any unexpected issues of substance other than just being about how the governance of the rebrand was handled. It's public that its Bob Petrigrew as the lead actor and that some forgot to sign (just listed  names: some of whom allegedly said they had nothing to do with it). Having been to an AGM I worry about how easy it would be to pack it with supporters of something daft and get a very unrepresentative motion through, so if it looks bad when I get my pack Ill be encouraging people to proxy vote if they can't go.

shark

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Has the wording of the no confidence motion been made public? I don't want to be a tease but somebody handed it to me today (they'd seen it through their club I think). I can post up here if it's of interest to people but no idea if it's confidential or not. I suppose if you're going to table a motion you have to expect that people might read it?

Go for it

Will Hunt

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With the caveat that I haven't been sent this directly by any of the signatories.










Pretty non-sensical if you ask me. Who are "the management, voluntary and paid, of the BMC"? Grimer who makes the nice guidebooks? Dan who advises people about gear? The access reps who work tirelessly for us? The national council members who give up their time to work in a voluntary capacity for their fellow climbers and walkers?
Sack o' shite.

EDIT / UPDATE
I'm happy for it to stay up but could you pop a note on that post explaining that it's a draft version? Just for the purposes of letting people know exactly what they're looking at.
« Last Edit: March 06, 2017, 10:53:22 pm by shark, Reason: reinstating copies of document »

Oldmanmatt

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That is utter bollocks.
Haven't they anything better to do with their lives?
Nothing but semantics and sour grapes. How do I exercise my proxy Simon?



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shark

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Haven't they anything better to do with their lives?
Nothing but semantics and sour grapes. How do I exercise my proxy Simon?

 :lol: Im flattered you think I'd know.

Glad to hear you're a member now  :clap2:

T_B

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There are some well respected names on there.

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Slightly confused reading that list at first, honestly thought there were some people with Yeti as a surname.

shark

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Slightly confused reading that list at first, honestly thought there were some people with Yeti as a surname.

Abominable

tomtom

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That's not a very good motion of no confidence imho. Surprised there wasn't a section about unsanctioned use of split infinitives...

Oldmanmatt

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There are some well respected names on there.

Is that important?


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cheque

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So much to love about that, but the highlight has to be the "collusion with the Japanese" bit. It's like something from the days of rival nations fighting to be the first to plant their flag on top of unclimbed mountains.

Brilliant how their opposition of the Climb Britain name has forced them to use the term "mountaineering community" to try and describe the BMC membership too.

Still, if there's one thing the political events of the last year has taught us it's that the motion will stand, this lot will be appointed the new board and within 12 months we'll be resigned to fighting plans to debolt sport crags, use British tech grades for boulder problems and remove topos from guidebooks. ;)
« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 07:34:14 pm by cheque »

northern yob

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There are some well respected names on there.

Which I have now lost a lot of respect for.

Oldmanmatt

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So much to love about that, but the highlight has to be the "collusion with the Japanese" bit. It's like something from the days of rival nations fighting to be the first to plant their flag on top of unclimbed mountains.

Brilliant how their opposition of the Climb Britain name has forced them to use the term "mountaineering community" to try and describe the BMC membership too.

Still, if there's one thing the political events of the last year has taught us it's that the motion will stand, this lot will be appointed the new board and within 12 months we'll be resigned to fighting plans to debolt sport crags, use British tech grades for boulder problems and remove topos from guidebooks. ;)

What pisses me off, is being 46, having been climbing rock, mountains and "doing" Expeds for over 30 years and still listening to the same reactionary shit as I had to in the '80s.
This has sod all to do with respect for the outdoors, the sport, or even the BMC membership; it's a total narcissistic, navel gazing, ego trip.


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Teaboy

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There are some well respected names on there.

There are, but now with a little less respect from me.

Seems every bit as pious whinging as we thought. That said I agree with the sport climbing thing but not sure of the significance nor whether it's anything to do with the BMC.

GraemeA

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Fucking awesome motion.

So just a couple of facts, and no not alternative facts.

The Japanese Mountaineering Association is in the middle of changing it's name to the Japanese Mountaineering and Climbing Association or something like that, the Japanese Alpine Club is a minor club, a bit like the AC in the UK.

The IFSC was formed in Feb 2007, so is not 15 years old as the "Motion" claims. And as Mark Vallance (apparently one of the signatories of the Motion) was there it seems a bit odd that he is making proposals against what he voted for, as BMC rep, a mere 10 years ago.

Where the hell is Lhose Hill Hall? Is it near Lhotse or is it near Castleton.

I am not always a fan of the BMC's management but this motion is so inaccurate and full of ambiguous BS that it should be kicked into touch at the earliest opportunity. I won't be at the AGM as I will be working at a comp in China bu I will definitely proxy someone to vote this down.

GraemeA

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There are some well respected names on there.

There are, but now with a little less respect from me.

Seems every bit as pious whinging as we thought. That said I agree with the sport climbing thing but not sure of the significance nor whether it's anything to do with the BMC.

Don't forget that for the rest of the world sport climbing (ie the UK definition of bolted climbing) is climbing. Hence the phrase sport climbing is generally recognised as meaning the sport of climbing ie the regulated activity of "competition" climbing.

Ru

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Thats not the motion actually submitted.

GraemeA

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Thats not the motion actually submitted.

Can we see the motion Ru. As a member I would like to have the info.

gme

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I think this, and the list of names attached, goes a good way to answering the original topic question for me.
Same bunch of names were around when the whole anti bolting bullshit started in the 80s.

Muenchener

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Don't forget that for the rest of the world sport climbing (ie the UK definition of bolted climbing) is climbing. Hence the phrase sport climbing is generally recognised as meaning the sport of climbing ie the regulated activity of "competition" climbing.

Not the whole of the rest of the world."Sportklettern" in German means pretty much the same as it does in English, "Alpinklettern" being what it's being distinguished from in this case.

Will Hunt

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Thats not the motion actually submitted.

I did wonder whether this might be a draft given that it seems to be full of quite reactionary phrasing. As I said before, I don't know the provenance of it, only that it came through some club channel or other.

I'll take it down now but hopefully the motion will be revealed soon. If one has been submitted and we're going to be asked to vote on it we're going to need to have a look at it.

EDIT: I've taken the pics off my Flickr hosting thing but they still seem to be showing on this page? Could a mod knock them out, please?
Furthermore, Offwidth has mentioned on the other channel that some of the names featured in the list are not aware that they're on there, which strikes me as concerning!
« Last Edit: March 04, 2017, 11:50:38 pm by Will Hunt »

Johnny Brown

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There are some well respected names on there.

Which I have now lost a lot of respect for.

Are any of them under 60?

Neil F

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Furthermore, Offwidth has mentioned on the other channel that some of the names featured in the list are not aware that they're on there, which strikes me as concerning!

The 'signatories' who denied having seen, or that they supported the original motion submitted, are not included in the list of supporters on the document you posted earlier Will.

Even if it is a draft, the document you posted does, presumably, give a very real insight into the issues concerning Pettigrew et al, which led him to submit the formal motion in the first place.

As such, I think it is very useful for people to be able to read it and make up their own minds.

No reason for Mods to delete it, that I can see...

Neil

shark

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Can we still keep it up Wil?

Dave Turnbull has referenced it on the ukc thread

Quote
In reply to Ian W:

Just to clarify a few things: the motion as published on UKB and in the link further up this thread is an earlier version of Bob Pettigrew's text from a few weeks ago; this version gives a flavour of the underlying issues but the motion formally submitted to the BMC on 16 Feb has been simplified to a more straightforward 'no confidence in the Executive Committee...' form of words, the accusation being that the BMC Exec (the Board of Directors) wilfuly and deliberately withheld 'future policy decisions' (presumably Climb Britain) from the AGM in April 2016. The BMC is still in correspondence with Bob Pettigrew on a few issues, in particular precisely who has formally signed up to the motion.

We should know by 9 March (the deadline for AGM submissions) exactly what is happening with this.


 

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