[jwi]

From the presentation it's quite clear that by max hangs she means first added weight than subtracted edge depth.

I was more getting at during the last study, where MAW followed by MED was compared with MED followed by MAW, MAW was used as the indicator of improvement; if the same has been applied during the recent study then I wouldn't find it surprising for the group carrying out a distinctly similar type of training to outperform those for instance following a MED protocol. However, as I said, I haven't (as of yet) read anything beyond the 'headlines'.

That's true, but isometric strength can basically only be tested in one way (modulo some small variations) if you want to publish in a peer-reviewed journal.

OTOH, for practitioners it would be best to see actual results on boulder grade of short problems. If the apparent strength on some wooden contraption increases, but actual strength on rock doesn't, well that is kind of worthless. That's why anecdotal evidence as in forums like this can be worthwhile

[Paul B]

It's never going to be perfect but I'd be interested to see testing covering all the protocols as a 'measurement' to see if it's just as you say, very specific to the training method employed...

[tomtom]

OK, so convinced by Moose that these can (a) be quite effective and (b) don't take too much time I've given these a go for the last couple of days..

Just to check I'm not doing anything stupidly wrong - after warming up I figured out my fail after 15 ish second weight (16kg - check me out!), and have the weight suspended from the waist belt of a harness - from the front loop. I then do 10 secs of hold - then a 3-4 min rest and repeat - approx 6-8 times (lost count..). Doing this on the small BM edges (seemed too easy on the large ones..).

[Murph]

Tomtom

That's pretty much what I'm doing these days in terms of volume but the difference is if I can get to 10 seconds I add weight next time. Sounds like if 15s is your max you won't be getting much out of sets of 10s specially if you can do 6-8 of them without fail...?

I struggle to do this with much structure but I always record the length of the hangs, the time of the hang so to avoid improving performance just by resting longer between "sets" and of course the weight. Recording is really important I reckon.

I never got on with repeaters but I've seen pretty good gains in 10 sessions by doing this. I've got full time childcare for a few months now so this will be my main training, I hope it works. Am at +35kgs now and when I get to +45kgs I'll change the focus to 3 finger hangs and just maintaining the 4 finger strength.

[moose]

Sounds roughly right Tom, although, when I was "Lopezing" I calculated the weight using the max I could hang for 12s when fully warmed-up.  I basically used the protocol on the UKBwiki:

The workout:
Warm-up 10-15min

Progressive sets: 10-15min
    Hang 10 sec with 40-50% of the total added weight. 3-4 min rest.
    Hang 10 sec with 80% of the total added weight. 3-4 min rest.
    Hang 10 sec with 90% of the total added weight. 3-4 min rest.

Main Workout: 10-20min
    Hang 10 sec with max weight. 3-4 min rest.
    Repeat 2-4 more times.

although, I usually did more than 3-4 max-hang - or did another full set on a different hold.

Lately though, I've been using Probes' 5x5x5 routine - seems to be a half-way house between max hangs and repeaters - 5x5s hangs with 5s rests with roughly the same weight as you use for the Lopez max hangs protocol (calculated diferently but the results is similar).

[tomtom]

Thanks Moose and Murph.

Ah. Ok so it tapers into the max set. I'm pretty close to failing on the ten secs by the 6th rep or so. So probably not too far off. I'll do this for a week then try wth some more weight. No point in going crazy to start with.