[mctrials23]

At most of the places I have climbed there are various 40 degree boards, system boards etc. Some places have a set of problems written down so you can try problems at a rough grade but most don't.

Is there an app out there that allows you to do something like:

Take a picture of a board, number the holds and then log problems on them to share with others? If not, is there anyone else who would be interested in something that does this?

Basically turn any board into a moon-esque thing where people can share problems and get a consensus on the grade of what they are climbing.

[masonwoods101]

There are apps where you can draw on a picture you take. Draw coloured circles etc. ive got one called 'paint on photos' on my iphone but there are better ones out there...

[36chambers]

For sharing problems, you could always set up a facebook group like the "Climbing Works Board Problems", which anyone can join and upload problems for people to try (they already have a picture template of the board, so you just need to add the circles). There's also a Leeds Depot one which has plenty of good, hard, problems set by local wads. 

[mctrials23]

I was going to build a web app to allow people to do this in a way that is easy to search and add boards / problems, grade and rate them etc.

Would anyone of you guys use it?

[Paul B]

If it was good then it'd beat Facebook groups that do the same!

[slackline]

I've done this using a Wiki for the sheffieldboulder.uk, registered users can add problems (so far thats me, DAVETHOMAS90).

It uses DokuWiki which has pretty simple syntax, although I'll probably migrate it to GitHub at some point to avoid hosting and domain fees (which aren't huge but I'd rather not be paying them).

[Luke Owens]

Would anyone of you guys use it?

I certainly would, I think it's a really good idea!

[filz]

+1 good idea

Inviato dal mio Nexus 6P utilizzando Tapatalk

[mctrials23]

Ok, I've pretty much got a working prototype ready but I was hoping to get some opinions from you lot.

As it stands the organisation of the app is as follows:

Walls - as it sounds, a physical location such as Climbing Works, The Arch etc

Boards - a particular board at a wall like the motherboard, a 40 degree board etc

Board sets - a particular set of holds on a board. This is a particular set of holds on a particular board. An example might be "July re-set of 40 degree board". This will be a user uploaded picture and then you will mark all the holds which will automatically be given a number.

Problems - a single problem related to a board set. You will pick the board set it is on and then tap the holds that make the problem. Other users will then be able to tap on the problem and see the holds it comprises.

I think this should be quite flexible and allow everything you would need but if there is anything that is confusing or missing just let me know. There is going to be stuff for people to suggest grades for problems and leave comments but thats not really important to the core.

The main thing I can't quite decide about is how to manage the walls, boards and board sets. What I don't want is for everyone to create a wall, add boards and board sets and we find that there are 10 Climbing Works, 8 motherboards and 20 versions of the same board sets.

I want people to create as many problems as possible but I want there to only be a single item for each wall, board and board set at any one time.

Any ideas on how to let users add this data without getting loads of duplicates. I know that it will change as it evolves but I want to at least get it off to a stable start.

[masonwoods101]

The only way to prevent duplicates of problems is to have a person that verifies the routes like on the ukc logbook but that sounds like a ball ache....

[slackline]

Any ideas on how to let users add this data without getting loads of duplicates. I know that it will change as it evolves but I want to at least get it off to a stable start.

You've got a centralised database recording input from users behind this all right?

Could you start by populating it with as much information as possible to begin with?

List as many walls as you can, and the boards within them.  These two at least will be fairly immutable, so you can reduce/avoid duplication at this level.

The sets vary on a given board, so that'll be trickier to avoid duplicates, e.g. one person might enter "July re-set of 40 degree board" another might enter "July 40 degree set".  You might be able to apply fuzzy matching to identify if a new set already exists.  Alternatively you might try using the date for a given wall/board and if someone tries to upload a new set on an existing wall/board they are presented with the existing ones first to check whether the set already exists.  At this point you can rely on the user not to duplicate, or you might try some fancy image comparison software to see if the picture they take and upload is of the same thing (something along the lines of a neural net, like Googles DeepMind or Udacity), but that doesn't guarantee success.

Alternatively you could contact walls or people who set at walls and ask them to upload pictures when the wall is set and limit users in this manner.  Might hinder uptake/usage of your application though.

[mctrials23]

Thanks for the replies guys.

masonwoods101, I would like to avoid heavy moderation / validation of data but I will obviously keep an eye on things and remove duplicates if necessary.

You've got a centralised database recording input from users behind this all right?

Yep

Could you start by populating it with as much information as possible to begin with?

The issue here is mainly getting good pictures of the current set on a given board. It has to be users that keep it up to date or it will be super limited. I go to 2 walls so thats not really much use!

List as many walls as you can, and the boards within them.  These two at least will be fairly immutable, so you can reduce/avoid duplication at this level.

As this is something that isn't likely to change often I am happy to do this but would prefer users to add it.

The sets vary on a given board, so that'll be trickier to avoid duplicates, e.g. one person might enter "July re-set of 40 degree board" another might enter "July 40 degree set".  You might be able to apply fuzzy matching to identify if a new set already exists.  Alternatively you might try using the date for a given wall/board and if someone tries to upload a new set on an existing wall/board they are presented with the existing ones first to check whether the set already exists.  At this point you can rely on the user not to duplicate, or you might try some fancy image comparison software to see if the picture they take and upload is of the same thing (something along the lines of a neural net, like Googles DeepMind or Udacity), but that doesn't guarantee success.

Image matching is a bit beyond the scope of this and I don't know of any publicly available tool to aid in this. My plan was to have quite a bit of checking before anything like a wall, set or board is added. When someone goes to add one to the app it will search for keywords in their title, location etc to see if there is already something nearby. Ultimately if someone wants to ignore that and submit it they will still be able to otherwise these things are prone to issues and might stop valid data getting added.

Alternatively you could contact walls or people who set at walls and ask them to upload pictures when the wall is set and limit users in this manner.  Might hinder uptake/usage of your application though.

This is something I have considered but I hope that if people start using it then some walls will have guys that work there that do this as a normal user would.

I should have something ready for testing in the next few weeks to a month. If you have any other thoughts I'm all ears and I will let you know when its ready for testing if you guys would like to give it a go.

[slackline]

If you'd  said all that at the outset I wouldn't have bothered responding.  Bar the suggestion of using neural networks to try and avoid duplicate images of the same sets of holds you've said you'd already thought of everything I suggested.

I think your best hope is to get staff/setters at walls to upload images when they are reset.  Perhaps augment this with masonwoods101 suggestion of board moderators, but you'll invariably get some people who think the image quality available is poor and why can't their image be uploaded and used, such is human nature.

[galpinos]

The issue here is mainly getting good pictures of the current set on a given board. It has to be users that keep it up to date or it will be super limited. I go to 2 walls so thats not really much use!

Well, just by asking UKB to help, you'd have a few walls covered, I'd happily do the Depot for you. However, better would be to contact the walls and get them to send you the photos and get their buy in. For the Depot in Manchester, there's actually a facebook page where people record their problems. They put a high quality photo of the board up and people edit it. I'm sure they'd happily give you a hand.

[slackline]

http://climbingmeta.com/