[mctrials23]

Its accepted that quality is more important than quantity when it comes to strength and power training but I have always wondered how much difference it makes when you try as hard as you can but simply cannot achieve your maximum output.

I imagine that most people would be able to perform better in a fingerboard workout if they had warmed up by climbing for a while beforehand. The vast majority of climbers don't have this luxury so we try and warm up at home by doing whatever gets us going (see thread about warming up for fingerboarding).

With a sub-optimal warm up the likelihood that you can have the best workout possible is reduced even if you are trying as hard as you can. E.g when fully warmed up perfectly you can one arm hang the beastmaker centre slot for 10s yet at home you can only do it for 3s. Is the value of this home workout severely deminished or is the fact that you are putting in the same effort levels as the 10s hang down the wall the important bit.

Perhaps I am just pants at warming up for a fingerboard session but this is something that I have wondered for a while.

[slackline]

thread about warming up for fingerboarding

.

Is the value of this home workout severely deminished or is the fact that you are putting in the same effort levels as the 10s hang down the wall the important bit.

Have you tried quantifying the effect under the two situations yourself?

Does it matter?  If the reason for doing the training at home is because you've limited free time to go and train at the wall in "optimal" conditions then surely doing something that closely resembles what you would be doing if you had the time, albeit acknowledging the lack of perfect setup, is better than sacking it off and breaking out the crisps and beer and putting your feet up in front of the TV for the evening.  v's 

[Eddies]

... plus, if you go to a the wall to warm up for a fingerboard session there is something seriously wrong!

[the_dom]

... plus, if you go to a the wall to warm up for a fingerboard session there is something seriously wrong!

To play devil's advocate, not necessarily - especially if you're prioritising fingerboarding and, for example, your local wall doesn't have a BM, or you find that you fingerboard better in the quiet environment of home.

[mctrials23]

If my local wall was 10 minutes away then I would certainly head down there to do a fingerboard session. 20 minutes travel which results in a much better session is well worth it in my view.

Back to the question. It wasn't "is it worth training at home" but more "how much difference does the ultimate performance have on its worth".

To simplify, if I can lift 100kg when perfectly warmed up down the gym and that is trying 100%, is there a 20%  reduction in value if I do the same at home but due to an imperfect warmup I can only manage 80kg when giving 100%.

If the effort of the muscles is 100% each time would it stimulate the same adaptation or is the actual weight the only really important part.

[blamo]

I can't comment on the results of suboptimal efforts. 

If the issue is limited to warming up, then could you look into ways to improve this?  For example, can you incorporate mobility drills, light repeater hangs, etc.? 

[slackline]

To simplify, if I can lift 100kg when perfectly warmed up down the gym and that is trying 100%, is there a 20%  reduction in value if I do the same at home but due to an imperfect warmup I can only manage 80kg when giving 100%.

If the effort of the muscles is 100% each time would it stimulate the same adaptation or is the actual weight the only really important part.

I very much doubt you will get a meaningful answer to this.

You can start trying to quantify it yourself though by spending a training period going exclusively to the wall and comparing it to a training period where you train only at home.

[abarro81]

1. It's perfectly possible to warm up and have a good fingerboard session at home.
2. In my opinion if it's not actually hard for you then it doesn't matter how hard it feels. Easy moves feel hard when you're knackered, but that doesn't mean you're doing much useful strength training when doing them.

[tommy_k]

1. It's perfectly possible to warm up and have a good fingerboard session at home.

[petejh]

I don't agree at all with the original premise that a workout at home results in sub-standard effort - in my experience it's the opposite when training finger srength on a BM or power on a campus board.
 
i.e. if I go to the wall to do my fb workout I know I give slightly less effort than at home because I'm self-conscious about being too vocal to give max effort in the wall with loads of punters and kids around.

At home I'm usually grunting and shouting some variation on COME ON YOU F*CKING C*NT! when things are getting a bit trying.

And warming up for a max effort fb session is totally feasable at home. I didn't take anything away from that thread about warming up, it's not hard to get blood flowing via around a thousand different ways of moving body parts.

It's the same for me with power training - I need to get vocal to give a proper 100%. But for this I do need a long warm-up prior to giving 100% plyometric effort. So I go to the wall for a 1hr warm-up, then I go to the mill (private board) to do the actual power workout on the campus board. Duiring a max effort campus workout I often shout obsenities at high volumne in a way you just can't get away with in an indoor wall without getting booted out for scaring the kids and upsetting the bumblies.

If you don't do this then I appluad your self-control, but tbh I wonder if you're really trying properly hard and as close to your 100% as you can.

[tommytwotone]

1. It's perfectly possible to warm up and have a good fingerboard session at home.

 




And also good as opposed to what - it's a hell of a lot better than nothing for someone like me who is time-poor, and only has the odd half-hour / hour time window once all my fatherly / cohabiter-ly duties are done that preclude a "proper" visit to the wall.

[mctrials23]

I have to say that I have never felt like screaming makes me try any harder or do any better. I pull weird faces when fingerboarding hard at my limit but I'm not vocal at all. I sit on my bum all day staring at a screen so I do find it hard to get warmed up at home to fingerboard. I find it quite tricky to do it at the wall as well but I particularly struggle at home. It seems that I am in the minority based on the replies so far however.

Perhaps I need to try all the ways people have given in the other thread.

[nai]

Perhaps I need to try all the ways people have given in the other thread.

You probably just need to take your time, I think people expect to get warm for a fingerboard session in a matter of minutes but in reality it'll take as long as warming up to climb at maximal effort.  The nature of being pushed for time as per the original thread probably doesn't help and means folk try to rush into it before they're ready.

As for shouting, I can't actually talk when I'm trying really hard, but I do find screaming helps. My neighbours must wonder about the noises coming out of the garage some mornings, summer gets interesting when the doors have to be open to keep it cool enough.

[ghisino]

I have to say that I have never felt like screaming makes me try any harder or do any better.

i find it a lot less relevant to hangs and static pulls than to actual climbing moves and campusing.
i see it as a variation of a forced/constricted exhalation: it makes your core stiffer...plus the psychological boost (that is variable among climbers, and the main reason why one would scream loudly instead of quietly grunting/puffing i guess?).

maybe this explains why you don't feel it relevant?

[Sasquatch]

Its accepted that quality is more important than quantity when it comes to strength and power training but I have always wondered how much difference it makes when you try as hard as you can but simply cannot achieve your maximum output.

I imagine that most people would be able to perform better in a fingerboard workout if they had warmed up by climbing for a while beforehand. The vast majority of climbers don't have this luxury so we try and warm up at home by doing whatever gets us going (see thread about warming up for fingerboarding).

I warm up better for my FB at Home, as well as performing better.  This is based on trying it both places. It took me about 12-14 sessions of trial and error before getting it dialed though.  You have to figure out what works for you.   

With a sub-optimal warm up the likelihood that you can have the best workout possible is reduced even if you are trying as hard as you can. E.g when fully warmed up perfectly you can one arm hang the beastmaker centre slot for 10s yet at home you can only do it for 3s. Is the value of this home workout severely deminished or is the fact that you are putting in the same effort levels as the 10s hang down the wall the important bit.

Tough to answer, but are you on the exact same board?  Is the difference consistent?  If you go down to the wall and warm-up, then come home and FB how does the session go?  Maybe it's that the home FB itself is harder for some reason.  I remember a discussion early on about the bm2k's when I first got mine, and often times the ones down at the wall are easier to hang as they are "stickier".  test it out see. 

Perhaps I am just pants at warming up for a fingerboard session but this is something that I have wondered for a while.

Perhaps, or perhaps something about the wall as a whole does a better job of getting you mentally ready. 

[TheTwig]

At home I'm usually grunting and shouting some variation on COME ON YOU F*CKING C*NT! when things are getting a bit trying.

  Seriously. I say to my climbing partner if I don't hear him making some kind of noise on the crux then it can't be that hard.

Same as pete, when I'm fingerboarding at home in my bedroom the neighbours must be wondering wtf is going on, I really am pretty much shouting on the last few sets of the session. lol.

[Pako]

Lately I have learnt the value of the warm up by bouldering. The other day I got up earlier to do a fb session, but didn't have time to boulder as well so just tried to fingerboard. Did shocking. Then yesterday I bouldered for a couple hours on the board and did some one arm hangs after, and it felt miles easier. Crazy. I also fell off the last easy move on a woody project I had been working for months, and let out a guttural yell of anger, and promptly felt like a cock because it was 10pm and I was outside. I never really make sounds while climbing, apart from quiet grunts. Malc and Jimmy Webb never seem to make noises while climbing, so there you have it.

[rodma]

I train in the morning before work, when work allows it, so am usually training from about 7:30 a.m.

i just warm up slow and if i don't manage to train as harrd as i would like because i run out of time it doesn't matter, I'm too old too rush it and end up injured, so try and do better the following session.

i find it harder to warm up after several days off. ideally I'd train each day, since i find this easiest and allows for a more contracted warm up, but getting up early every day would be really tiring

[Nibile]

The quality of training at home is - in my case - infinitely higher than in any gym.
Leaving aside the fact that I can train whenever I like, and that I have all the food and coffee that I need, the real advantages are that my Beastmaker hasn't seen all the traffic of a gym, so it's still quite neat and truly hard; my board is built exactly according to my needs and desires, every hold is there for a specific aim, and every hold is super clean despite the abuse: no shoe rubber on, no liquid chalk; I have all the time in the world to give a problem a go: I can watch tv, lay on the mats, do whatever I want, and when I want to crush it, there's no one in front of me to wait for; I have all my projects, that have been being there for years now, and that will keep being there, so that I can measure progress in terms of years, and not one or two months.
I like to go and visit gyms, though, but I consider it like a day out: climbing loads, having fun, trying different stuff, having a reference on others' problems, practicing flashes. But not training.

[PipeSmoke]

if I go to the wall to do my fb workout I know I give slightly less effort than at home because I'm self-conscious about being too vocal to give max effort in the wall with loads of punters and kids around.

At home I'm usually grunting and shouting some variation on COME ON YOU F*CKING C*NT! when things are getting a bit trying.

This for sure, I battle hard at home and must look like a right spanner by the end, but at home you can really give it everything.
Also if you feel you aren't/can't get warmed up properly then carry on warming, do it gradually, whether its hanging off jugs for a bit or whatever, I find it is just as feasable to warm up at home.

Remember, you can try 100% at home, even in the nude to save weight for those extra small crimps