[mctrials23]

Pretty simple question; how many of you follow a training plan most of the year. I'm sure that a lot of us will try and target some aspect of our climbing for a while to improve it but in my experience, its really hard to follow a regimented training plan.

I started a 8 week power endurance program and made it about 3 weeks in before I gave up. It was boring, didn't bring any real improvements (which I'm 99% sure is because I only made it 3 weeks in) and I couldn't resist the lure of the 100 or so new problems I could have been climbing instead of doing 4x4s and circuit board work.

I don't mind doing fingerboarding at home but its an hour to my nearest wall so travelling for 2 hours to do barely more than an hour of boring training is hard to stomach.

How do you guys make a plan and stick to it when its so hard. I guess if I had managed it in the past and seen big improvements I might find it easier to rationalise.

[galpinos]

I have just started due to the fact that life, work and family were getting in the way and my climbing seemed to be going backwards. I have limited free time so want to make sure it is used as well as possible so that when the opportunity to go outside appears, I can perform.

Time will tell whether I stick with it or not, I’m in week three! Ask me again in 12 months……..

[SA Chris]

My training plans normally end prematurely because I injury myself

[tomtom]

Try and climb or train 3 times a week... thats my plan.

[blamo]

I tend to follow fairly specific training plans with some success.  I usually do 3 to 6 week "cycles."  I will focus on training for a specific short term goal during the cycle (e.g. red point all the routes at my gym in a specific grade range, do the crux boulder of a long term project, or link a certain section of a long term project, etc.). 

I tend to tailor my training to the goal I am trying (e.g. hangboard on holds specific to your goal, climb on problems).  I tend to have similar results to what you are describing if I have a plan that just focuses on a general improvement area such as endurance or power. 

If I was in a position of wanting to improve endurance and having a large number of new problems to work I might pick a goal of something like try to link 4 or 5 boulder problems back to back within a certain number of weeks (project all the problems, start linking the problems back to back, and then start adding harder problems, or switching around the order once I could *red point* my first set of problems).

Hopefully the above will have some value.  Good luck.

[mctrials23]

Cheers for the replies guys, seems like most people just do what I do.

I don't necessarily feel like I have plateaued massively, I just want to improve as quickly as I can.

I know that one of the main things top climbers say is to work you're weaknesses so i am trying to address that at the moment but they don't usually explain why.

Is it to make you a better all round climber?

I understand that in bodybuilding you eventually compromise your gains if you don't target all areas of your body so is that the same in climbing?

I know that fixing weaknesses will ultimately enable you to climb a larger variety of stuff at a certain grade but wouldn't focussing on your strengths push your maximum grade more?

[Muenchener]

I have spells when I focus more - though not exclusively - on different aspects. For example a few weeks doing al ot of ARC in December-January, then bouldering / fingerboard in February-Marc,h then a few weeks of PE stuff, all leading up to a late spring / early summer sport climbing season. I suppose that's a training plan of sorts, but the "phases" don't involve full-on OCD weeks-in-advance planning. Far from it.

[slackline]

I know that one of the main things top climbers say is to work you're weaknesses so i am trying to address that at the moment but they don't usually explain why.

Is it to make you a better all round climber?

I know that fixing weaknesses will ultimately enable you to climb a larger variety of stuff at a certain grade but wouldn't focussing on your strengths push your maximum grade more?

If its a weakness then there is there is more scope for improvement than in areas you are already proficient at, hence why you will see greater gains faster than trying to eek out a small improvement in something you are already good at.

[mctrials23]

 :devangel:oh I understand that slack line but it won't actually affect your maximum grade will it. You may be able to climb v8 on crimpy routes and only v5 on slopy ones but bringing your sloper strength up to par won't mean you are suddenly climbing v9.

That improvement to get to v9 will still be just as hard no?

[Stubbs]

Consider more the flexibility thread as an example; if there was a v9 Crimpy problem that required a very open hip or stretched out heel hook, by training those specifics without improving your strength you will improve on that climb and also have improved your 'move toolbox'

[bendavison]

I follow a training plan most of the time. Sometimes its more regimented than others. For it to work  if I have I find I need set goals that I really do care about and think are achievable (both difficulty-wise and practically), and if I believe the plan will get me there.

Re training weakness: I prefer to think of it as training the limiting factors related to the things I want to climb.

[T_B]

I followed a 12-wk plan prior to a trip last autumn. It made me do things I would normally make excuses not to bother with. It sort of worked and I've sort of started a new plan with spring goals in mind. It's not absolutely regimented and as I'm an old git, I have to listen to my body. A training plan works for me as a) I have v little time, so can't get out on rock much. I want to maximise what I do rather than dicking around having fun and b) I need to get better to stay interested as I've been living in the same place for 15 yrs and am running out of things to do.

I don't think 3 weeks is long enough to have decided you're not getting gains.

I probably wouldn't follow much of a plan if I was 20 years younger, so long as I was enjoying climbing and had plenty of time to get out/travel to a variety of venues. Part of me finds it a bit sad that younger climbers are training so hard and not actually climbing many routes/visiting different areas.

[nathanie1]

oh I understand that slack line but it won't actually affect your maximum grade will it. You may be able to climb v8 on crimpy routes and only v5 on slopy ones but bringing your sloper strength up to par won't mean you are suddenly climbing v9.

That improvement to get to v9 will still be just as hard no?

If you are a well rounded v8 climber, with no obvious weaknesses, then you aren't limiting yourself to a particular type of v9 problem and therefore you have more v9's to go at. Shirley this will increase your chances of ticking one, and then another, and another... 


With regards to training plans, I have a long list of problems I want to/can't do and a long list of things to improve to help my do said problems. Whenever I find myself indoors I work on whatever weakness is holding me back from my favourite problems of the moment. One day I'll probably adopt an actual training plan.

[Sasquatch]

Yes I do.  It's planned and structured around my personal situation and goals.

For example, this last fall I had two major goals, a local project in Sept/Early Oct, and a bishop trip in Nov.  I also had a trip in August to Squamish, and was trying to get back to full strength after injuring a pulley in March (grade 2/3).  Building backwards from the goals, I had about 7 weeks between the two goals, and about 8 weeks between squamish and Local Project. 

So my training was:
Squamish
Week 1-4 - 2 days FB, 1 day bouldering (hopefully outside)
Week 5-8 - 2 days Campus, 1 day bouldering on local project (sent on week 7)
Weeks 9-11 -  FB 2-3 per week
Weeks 12-15 - 2 days Campus, 1 day boulder
Week 16 - easy week prior to trip

The FB was a specififc workout, as were the campusing days.  The bouldering days were all very high intensity days working 3-5 problems at my limit. 

You can structure training around having fun and enjoying climbing, but you have to set your goals and priorities.  All of my outside days started with a solid warmup, then working the project for about 1-2 hours until it was pretty obvious there was no progression, then I went and played and had fun climbing/exploring/developing for the rest of the day. I could get outside about once a week, so that was my #1 focus.  Also, the campusing days involved quite a bit of climbing to warm-up and cool down, so I never really felt like I was missing climbing.  The FB days can get old, but it's only for about 3-4 weeks, and I still toss in a few climbing days to break it up.

Cheers for the replies guys, seems like most people just do what I do.

I don't necessarily feel like I have plateaued massively, I just want to improve as quickly as I can.

How do you define improvement?
 

I know that one of the main things top climbers say is to work you're weaknesses so i am trying to address that at the moment but they don't usually explain why.

Is it to make you a better all round climber?

Partly, others have mentioned a couple of reasons and I'll mention another.  A weakness will hold you back without you knowing it.  For the better part  of a decade, my fingers were relatively weak.  I could still climb fairly hard, but what I didn't know was how my fingers were limiting the techniques I could apply.  It's really hard for me to explain, but when you fix a weakness, you sometimes find yourself seeing and making moves you would have never connected to that weakness. 

I understand that in bodybuilding you eventually compromise your gains if you don't target all areas of your body so is that the same in climbing?

I know that fixing weaknesses will ultimately enable you to climb a larger variety of stuff at a certain grade but wouldn't focussing on your strengths push your maximum grade more?

Are you trying to push your peak, or build your base. They really should go hand in hand.  I'll typically cycle between the two.  During the early part of the summer, I try to build more base, then at the end of the season, I try to push my peak. 

[TheTwig]

I've started the training cycle as advocated by the Anderson brothers in the Rock Climbers Training Manual, and have all of 2015 planned, with trips pencilled in for each peak. I'm just peaking now, and (no pun intended) heading to the peak for 8 days on the 14th for some gritstone. I've tailored each training phase on where the season trip is and what the rock is like. So for the grit I had a big fingerboarding phase, lots of openhanded hangs etc, as well as slopers, medium power phase and then a very small PE phase. I'm feeling stronger than I ever have before and it shows in what I'm climbing indoors.

Compliance wise I've found writing it down and going to the wall with a written down plan definitely helps. I overtrained a lot in the fingerboard phase and wrecked my elbows, by doing too much climbing with not enough rest inbetween FB sessions, and had to skip a fair few FB sessions due to injury etc :\ . Lesson learned for in a few months when I get around to that again. I actually enjoyed fingerboarding, I have the Rock Prodigy FB with a pulley system and it was fun seeing my grip strength going up. I tracked it all on a spreadsheet and made a chart etc etc.

As others have said working your weaknesses definitely is the way forward. Do you really want to be shut down on a problem or route because of 1 sloping hold, or whatever? I used to crimp everything and when it came to things I couldn't crimp I didn't have a chance. Ditto slopers. Now my strongest grip is open hand and palm strength is pretty good. Same with overhanging climbing, when I started actually thinking about the discrepancy, I was bouldering up to f7a indoors on slab problems, meanwhile f6a on an overhang was quite a struggle. That's a bit of an ongoing battle! 

(I'm fairly new to climbing training before everyone laughs at my somewhat crap grip strength )

[jwi]

Not most of the year, no.

If by plan you mean something else than “climb lots, 90% onsight, get weak as a kitten.”

Most of the time I made and followed training plans I made good gains.

[cheque]

I've only ever followed a training plan when I've had an overseas sport trip coming up. Otherwise I just try and go rock climbing whenever I can, which is not conducive to having a training plan (and vice versa) I find, particularly when it's BST rather than GMT.

When I've had a plan I've achieved exactly what I've been training for. It hasn't always been what I've wanted to train for or thought I've been training for though. I find training and climbing on plastic can make me "better" without having any impact on what grades I can climb on rock!

[csl]

Having it written and printed out seems to help me stick with it. I have this on the wall above my desk, so its impossible to avoid.


Then the thing that really helps me stick with it is benchmarking every three months or so. If i can get some metric of improvement, its so much easier to motivate myself to keep trying!

Why not see how much weight (if any) you need to take off with a pulley set up to one arm hang a one pad edge for 5 seconds - then repeat that every so often to see if you are getting stronger? Or for power endurance you could see how many moves of foot on campusing you can do at a max effort, and then repeat that as a benchmark.

[Pebblespanker]

...  it is benchmarking every three months or so. If i can get some metric of improvement, its so much easier to motivate myself to keep trying!

Why not see how much weight (if any) you need to take off with a pulley set up to one arm hang a one pad edge for 5 seconds - then repeat that every so often to see if you are getting stronger? Or for power endurance you could see how many moves of foot on campussing you can do at a max effort, and then repeat that as a benchmark.

Absolutely 100% agree - I did a bench-marking session on Saturday for my new strength cycle that is planned to lead up to a 4 day County trip at Easter - like Chris I have had an injury riddled last few months that torpedoed the last lot of plan/s. One other bonus of bench marking is you see exactly how much progress you lose when you switch between training types as well as any hiatus due to injury, xmas, family holiday's, work etc. As I have target problems in the County I am also focusing on certain grip/hold types and have tweaked the plan accordingly. If it's a local problem I would aim to have sessions on it every month to 6 weeks to measure progress, rather than more frequently - this works for me as I gain slowly and reduces the number of what can become demotivating (for me) failed attempts - everyone's different, so you need to work out what is best for you mentally and physically around your plan to maximise gains

FWIW I use an Excel spreado to plan and track my training - I use lots of graphs as I (am sad and) find them motivational - so long as they are going the right way!

[mctrials23]

How are you guys tracking your fingerboard sessions beyond a general summary of the session or a simple explanation of what you did.

I am doing some one arm hangs and would want to track:

duration of hang,
hold used,
number of fingers used on hold
weight removed via pulley.

That doesn't make it easy to "chart" progress as far as I can see. At the moment I am just logging when the session was, how much weight was removed and a general summary of what I did that was hard. Hopefully this will give me a loose overview of whether I am improving or not.

Another thing I was wondering about is how much resistance a pulley adds to the system. I have a pulley attached to the bottom of my fingerboard which I run a cord through with one end attached to a weight plate and the other is a foot strap to stand in.

I try to minimise any cross loading when I use it but I'm sure that the pulley adds quite a bit of resistance on top of the weight on the end of it.

[Stubbs]

If you are recording the weight you take off for each grip for a given length of time then is should be very simple to chart progress?

In this situation the resistance of the pulley doesn't matter as that is a constant.

[Pebblespanker]

For me a detailed Excel spreadsheet works. I use the same data as you plus grip type, half-crimp or Open handed, I monitor starting set up e.g. Beasty 1K, Deep 3F Hold, 6 reps @ 6secs with 10KG taken off, then track % gains in reps, duration, weight added/removed with simple formulae.

benchmark = 6 reps @ 6 secs, (10kg removed)
6 reps @7 secs  = 17% gain in duration
6 reps @8 secs etc. = 33% gain in duration
etc

Excel is good for this if you set it up correctly and suits me because I use in my day job. I wouldn't worry about the precise physics of the assistance, what I focus on is same set up each time and the amount of weight slowly coming down. Set firm rules for progression e.g. once I can do 6 reps for 10secs with 10Kg assistance for X (I use 2-3) consecutive training sessions then remove 2.5kg and see how long you can hang the 6 reps for

[slackline]

then track % gains in reps, duration, weight added/removed with simple formulae.

I wouldn't advise the use of percentage change

[mctrials23]

Cheers for the replies but how do you plot more than 2 things on a graph?

If I am tracking length of hold and weight added against a calendar how does that work? You would also have a graph for every single grip position on every different hold I assume?

Also, although the resistance on the pulley is constant for a given weight it will obviously change if the weight changes. For 50kg it may be an added resistance of 20kg whereas for 20kg it may only be 5kg. Its not likely to be a simple function of the weight added times a percentage.

I may be talking utter crap here but thats my understanding of these things.

[slackline]

Cheers for the replies but how do you plot more than 2 things on a graph?

If I am tracking length of hold and weight added against a calendar how does that work? You would also have a graph for every single grip position on every different hold I assume?

Either come up with your own metric or assess yourself in two ways by either fixing the weight added and seeing how long you can old, or fixing the amount of time you hold and adding weight until you can only hold for that period.  The former is likely easier and you then plot x-axis with time (in training calendar) and y-axis with the length of time you can hold a given hold, with a separate line for each hold/grip.

When you come to adding a different amount of weight you'll see a sudden step down in the length of time you can hold (since you've upped the intensity of the training and made the exercise harder).

Also, although the resistance on the pulley is constant for a given weight it will obviously change if the weight changes. For 50kg it may be an added resistance of 20kg whereas for 20kg it may only be 5kg. Its not likely to be a simple function of the weight added times a percentage.

Thats the sort of crap calculations that was taught in Applied Mathematics when I started doing it at A-Level (quickly ditched in favour of Statistics).  Search around and I'm sure you can find out how to do the calculations.  Try Wolfram Alpha.  You'll probably need to measure the frictional properties of the pulley itself.

I doubt its worth worrying too much about myself.

[Stubbs]

Cheers for the replies but how do you plot more than 2 things on a graph?

If I am tracking length of hold and weight added against a calendar how does that work? You would also have a graph for every single grip position on every different hold I assume?

Also, although the resistance on the pulley is constant for a given weight it will obviously change if the weight changes. For 50kg it may be an added resistance of 20kg whereas for 20kg it may only be 5kg. Its not likely to be a simple function of the weight added times a percentage.

I may be talking utter crap here but thats my understanding of these things.

Most assisted weight fingerboard routines will be about the amount of weight you need to take off (or add) to achieve a certain length of hand, this way you only have the weight and date for each grip to plot (or just write down in your diary).

Are you really bothered about exactly how much effect the pulley is having, or can you accept that it will have some impact, but the aim of your training is just to reduce the amount of weight you are putting on the other end? 

I think it's easy to get lost in the minutiae of these things when all you want is a rough way to track how trying really hard is improving your fingerstrength.

[Pebblespanker]

Very fair comment Slackline and fully understand what you are saying (% changes need to be stated against the starting conditions and starting conditions should be the same for all so you can compare apples with apples) but mathematical nuances aside the % route works as a simple personal motivator/indicator for me in a spreado.  I could equally express change as 1 second gain, 2 second gain so the gain is expressed independent of starting conditions, but this all goes to crap once you add remove weight - all I want to see day to day is a measure of improvement via a number saying 'you have improved you beast'

For overall improvement at the end of a cycle I redo the baseline test under the exact same conditions, same added/removed weight, same hold and grip and time the hangs to failure

[Nibile]

I haven't followed a "real" training plan in years, mostly because of work, which often makes spare time unpredictable.
My only plan is the aim of getting stronger, so I adapt every session to how I feel, how the week is probably going to be - work wise - if/when I plan to climb, etc.
As said, I have the luxury of having a board (yes DaveMac, I made a board before you said), a fingerboard, a systemboard and a lot, a lot of different tested sessions that I can use at will depending on the day and time.

The only thing that I really track is my fingers' sessions.
With little time, I tend to overdo them to the detriment of board climbing, that requires more time. So, now, I decided to do only one fingers' session per week, alternating between the two sessions that I normally do.
So, one week is max hangs on the BM (one armed, with added weight, half crimp and monos), the other is max hangs on the systemboard (full crimp). The rest is board climbing, doing short, hard bouldering sessions earlier in the week, and slightly decreasing intensity as tiredness kicks in day by day.

Then: I wrote here about weeks to be more clear, but in reality I don't care about calendar weeks. I choose the sessions regardless of weekdays, but only according to the previous training days.
So, if by accident I climb on a Monday, I take Tuesday off and will fingerboard on Wednesday, that will be the first day of the training week. Then, depending on when/if I go climbing, I will tailor this "new" week, adapting the training to the climbing or the climbing to the training: if I know that conditions are going to be good and I want to work the project, I tailor the training; if I don't want to perform on rock I factor the day out as training as act as a consequence.

Caveat: I love training and almost don't go on rock anymore, I could easily just train, and I don't have to peak at fixed dates for trips and so on, so this makes things easier for me.
HTH.

[mctrials23]

Caveat: I love training and almost don't go on rock anymore, I could easily just train, and I don't have to peak at fixed dates for trips and so on, so this makes things easier for me.
HTH.

Good to see people that are honest about what they get out of climbing. I have never lived in a place where I can climb outside very often without huge amounts of travel and disappointment with the British weather so enjoying my training and sessions at the wall is vital to me.

My current goal for this year is to get outside more as the year goes on. Hopefully my other half will be more excited to climb outdoors as she gets better at climbing which will make things easier. My other goals are to be able to one arm a lot of stuff on the BM2000 without taking weight off and climb something close to 8a outside. One arming stuff on the BM might not seem super hard but I weigh over 13 stone so I think thats a reasonable goal.

[Johnny Brown]

Petzl's advice is that a percentage is close enough at typical climbing use loads. Which pulley are you using? They range from ~80-95% efficiency.

[mctrials23]

I'm using a petzl one and I did a rough test last night to see what the resistance is. I put 20kg on each side of the pulley and then added weight to one side until it became almost effortless to move the weight down on that side. It was about 5-7kg so it's more like 30%. It's a pulley from about 4 years ago though so oiling it would probably help a lot.

[slackline]

I'm using a petzl one and I did a rough test last night to see what the resistance is. I put 20kg on each side of the pulley and then added weight to one side until it became almost effortless to move the weight down on that side. It was about 5-7kg so it's more like 30%. It's a pulley from about 4 years ago though so oiling it would probably help a lot.

If you're worried about minutiae like this then "almost effortless" is pretty pointless and "between 5 and 7kg" is too inaccurate, you could buy some Newton meters and work it out exactly.

In the meantime perhaps this pulley simulator will allow you to investigate the effect friction at the pulley (i.e. resistance) has on the force required.

[blamo]

In the meantime perhaps this pulley simulator will allow you to investigate the effect friction at the pulley (i.e. resistance) has on the force required.

This explains why going from removing weight to adding weight is a bit of hurdle.   

[slackline]

Isn't that obvious?

[Nibile]

I understand that it could be of some interest to know exactly how much weight you have to take off, but I wouldn't stress to much about it. Once you you use the same pulley every time, it is a constant so there's no problem in judging progress.

[blamo]

Isn't that obvious?

When I am hanging from my fingertips trying to eek out a bit more effort nothing seems obvious.  I always attributed it to too much 

[Muenchener]

I'm using a petzl one and I did a rough test last night to see what the resistance is. I put 20kg on each side of the pulley and then added weight to one side until it became almost effortless to move the weight down on that side. It was about 5-7kg so it's more like 30%. It's a pulley from about 4 years ago though so oiling it would probably help a lot.

I'm using a fairly new micro traxion, so the pulley itself is about 90% efficient. But there's only one of it, meaning that the cord and the weight are hanging in contact with my torso, so a lot of friction there probably.

But shirley the friction losses - whatever they are - mean you're actually getting *less* assistance than the weight you have on the other end of the string?

[abarro81]

No, because the arm on the rope (or your body if 2 armed) is trying to move the rope through the pulley, and the friction is opposing this movement, i.e. opposing the pull from that arm: the same effect as increasing the weight.

[rodma]

If you mean increasing the weight of the climber,  then you just angrily agreed with munchie's point Alex.
If that's not what you meant then you just disagreed with yourself.

[abarro81]

I mean increasing the weight of the assist. I fail to see how I disagreed with myself? 1 arm hang, 1 arm on rope, through pulley, weight on other side. Arm on rope tries to move rope by pulling on it. Friction opposes this motion, which is the equivalent of increasing the assisting weight for a frictionless pulley.

[rodma]

I mean increasing the weight of the assist. I fail to see how I disagreed with myself? 1 arm hang, 1 arm on rope, through pulley, weight on other side. Arm on rope tries to move rope by pulling on it. Friction opposes this motion, which is the equivalent of increasing the assisting weight for a frictionless pulley.

Only in one direction does it increase the assistance and that's on the lower, on the upwards motion the assistance is reduced, unless you're some sort of wizard.

Of your not moving ie one arm hang them you're effectively in equilibrium depending on which way you last moved so either you will have greater or lesser assistance, or it'll sorry itself out and it'll be closer to the actual amount of weight off.

[abarro81]

When I do assisted 1 arm hangs the hand on the rope only ever pulls too hard (i.e. tries to pull the rope through the pulley), never too little!

[Muenchener]

When I do assisted 1 arm hangs (etc)

That's probably where we're cross purposes. Struggle if you can to imagine somebody who is so weak they need assistance on two arm hangs.

Now the string is not being pulled on by a hand, it is clipped onto a harness, going from there up to the pulley, and down the other side to a weight. The downward pull of the weight on the other side is - I believe - being resisted and reduced by the friction of the downward leg of the string against the climber's body.

[rodma]

Yes, you are at cross purposes so we are all right and wrong except me and except when I said  that it very much depends on the direction of travel, which I was right about.
:D

[abarro81]

Sorry Muenchener, but, if you're failing on a 2 arm hang then your body pulls the rope through so it's still the equivalent of more weight...

[rodma]

Back in the day before cheap pulleys and when people had ready access to bungees, that's what we used and had a whole different calculation to do, but at least the direction of travel didn't affect the level of assistance.

We use an anchor point on the ceiling with a pulley for weights etc (used to be the mounting point for rings before the novelty wore off) and the effect of friction in the different directions is so apparent that it makes using it (trying to replicate long deep pulls in different positions ) almost too shot to continue with. I now use the theraband instead

[rodma]

Sorry Muenchener, but, if you're failing on a 2 arm hang then your body pulls the rope through so it's still the equivalent of more weight...

Depends on the weight added shirley

[abarro81]

Huh? Don't understand. You're right about direction of travel, but we can assume the fail is gradually going downwards in most deadhang situations. What depends on the weight added?

Not that any of this matters. Hang, try really really hard, reduce the assistance. Pretty much covers it!

[Muenchener]

Not that any of this matters. Hang, try really really hard, reduce the assistance. Pretty much covers it!

Quite. Whether I'm getting 4kg or 6kg of assistance from my 5kg weight is immaterial: when I reduce the weight using the same setup, then I'm getting less assistance.

[rodma]

Huh? Don't understand. You're right about direction of travel, but we can assume the fail is gradually going downwards in most deadhang situations. What depends on the weight added?

Not that any of this matters. Hang, try really really hard, reduce the assistance. Pretty much covers it!

If munchy had added sufficient weight that he isn't moving downwards, then it's harder to work out what level of assistance he is gaining.

If you are always heading downwards then you are getting greater assistance.

If you were to select a higher weight you could do assisted one-armers or locks. Heading south isn't always the best option after all, a maximal pull can be upwards (but only for one trip right enough)