[andy_e]

I'm rolling with my foam off safety. Aldi currently have them on sale for 2.8 fuck-alls which is quite bargainous.

Anybody else use foam rollers and have any good tips and regimes or links to useful articles specific to climbing? I had originally bought it with the intention of aiding recovery (roll the DOMS away) and relieving back issues, but is ti any good for core work too? Might as well get full use of it seeing as I have the core strength of a wet paper towel.

Ta!

[jfdm]

Hi andy_e,

A good place to start is look at anything by Kelly Starrett.
http://www.mobilitywod.com/episodes/page/7/
There is a load of stuff on youtube as well as a few books.

He is massive in us, regarding stretching/ mobility, cross-fit etc.
He has performed in the US Olympic team in the canoe.
So knows a thing or two about stretching/training.

The foam roller is used mainly to aid recovery/stretch.
Although like you when you roll you i do seem to engage the core.


Don't have anything specific for climbing though.


Hope this helps


jfdm

[tomtom]

Hows the coverage using emulsion?

[andy_e]

Patchy, I prefer to use a TV aerial.

[jfdm]

Tomtom.

I would have thought with your bad back you would be the one person on ukb  that would appreciate a good foam roller?

It's amazing what you can get down bnq/screwfix?

 

[Falling Down]

I've got one,  great for preventing DOMS and quite good to do late in the evening with a herbal tea before bedtime.

[andy_e]

Maybe it was the lack of herbal tea, but rolling foam just before bed last night seemed to exacerbate my DOMS and meant I had an uncomfortable night's sleep!

Thanks for the tips jfdm, I'll look into that site in more detail once I'm home.

[tomtom]

Tomtom.

I would have thought with your bad back you would be the one person on ukb  that would appreciate a good foam roller?

It's amazing what you can get down bnq/screwfix?

 

I've been told no massage still... ice, rest and gentle stretching.. not complaining - it seems to be working...

[jfdm]

Tomtom.

I would have thought with your bad back you would be the one person on ukb  that would appreciate a good foam roller?

It's amazing what you can get down bnq/screwfix?

 

I've been told no massage still... ice, rest and gentle stretching.. not complaining - it seems to be working...

I am pleased that your back is getting better.
Nothing worse than a bad back.
Once you are up and running have a look at the starett website/YouTube.
You might find it useful?

[Paul B]

Recently I had an issue with my back. Its been there for a while, a deep ache underneath my R scapula a few hours after training, but landing straight-legged really did trigger a world of hurt and I've been uncomfortable for the past week sleeping etc.


I have a few massage balls:
Spikey - physion room - OK a bit soft perhaps
Beastie Roller - firm, definitely better, glad I didn't pay for it!

and as a last ditch hope started looking towards foam rollers but I thought I'd do a quick google and found this from T-Nation:

It started to concern me years ago, when I first began to add foam rolling and correctives to my training sessions. I noticed something very troubling – my athletes in the weightroom were conducting themselves with the intensity of middle-aged women waiting for the next hot yoga class.

...

As we wade through what seems like a new fad or catchall term each year – with core, functional, thoracic mobility (and all the other adjectives put in front of "mobility"), foam rolling, and the use of the word "elite" being the big sinners – it becomes increasingly apparent that while the original idea might've been sound, the hucksters and hawkers have left us wondering if we're going to die if we don't rub out our soft tissues.

http://www.t-nation.com/training/foam-rollers-are-for-wimps

That latter paragraph really struck a cord with what I see happening in the world of climbing training so I took a step back and was meaning to post a similar topic to see what the wisdom of UKB has to say, hopefully including some SCIENCE?

[andy_e]

I wonder if it is faddy, or just another tool in the box for all over body conditioning/recovery that's taken a while to leak over from other disciplines? Anecdotal evidence tends to suggest a benefit for those who say they roll, so is it really a bad thing even if it is a fad?

[Monolith]

I'm rolling with my foam off safety. Aldi currently have them on sale for 2.8 fuck-alls which is quite bargainous.

Made a quick note of this and popped in to Aldi when I was just out. Alas no foam rollers there nor a person on the shop floor to advise of their availability. Have they just come in do you know Andy?

[andy_e]

It was a while back when they came in beast, just after new year I think. I bought mine last night, it wasn't the last one in the shop either. Might be worth taking the Lexus around the ring road and finding another Aldi, or getting others in other areas to put out their feelers for you...

Anyway, no rolling until you've bottled that whisky.

[Falling Down]

I wonder if it is faddy, or just another tool in the box for all over body conditioning/recovery that's taken a while to leak over from other disciplines? Anecdotal evidence tends to suggest a benefit for those who say they roll, so is it really a bad thing even if it is a fad?

The GJ guys have been using them for years and they tend not to get influenced by anything faddy and won't recommend anything that doesn't work..

[Paul B]

so is it really a bad thing even if it is a fad?

Well, yes, unless it's worth doing I don't want to give up time doing it? It depends on the strength and credibility of the anecdotal evidence.

The GJ guys have been using them for years and they tend not to get influenced by anything faddy and won't recommend anything that doesn't work..

Can I quote myself before I've finished posting 

[andy_e]

Well, yeah, the reason I qualified it as anecdotal is because usually anecdotal evidence is bollocks 

I get your point about it potentially being a waste of time though, I hadn't thought of it like that. It does feel nice to do though...

[highrepute]

Surprised at the lack of use on here. I thought they were well established. Got the whole range of this kind of kit in our house. Partner a physio. This is the bit I use the most. Mostly for back and shoulder stuff. 

[chris j]

I'm intrigued by this T-nation rant on using foam rollers too much and turning into wimps, does anyone actually use them as more than a very minor part of a work-out to break up stiff tissue before/during stretching?

[Sasquatch]

but rolling foam just before bed last night seemed to exacerbate my DOMS and meant I had an uncomfortable night's sleep!

This is quite common.  Do it morning after a hard workout instead.  You tend to be stiff in the AM as yuor muscles are tighter, so this can help loosen the muscles up and increase circulation without engaging them and without tearing them like stretching can. 

I wonder if it is faddy, or just another tool in the box for all over body conditioning/recovery that's taken a while to leak over from other disciplines? Anecdotal evidence tends to suggest a benefit for those who say they roll, so is it really a bad thing even if it is a fad?

I think it became very faddy when it hit the crossfit/GJ groups which are extremely faddy. 

Doing it to enhance recovery between workouts - Very good.  Foam Rollers, Tennis Balls, and such have been used by PT's for decades now, so certainly less faddy amongst that group.  Personally I like a lacrosse ball   very firm, but I can really dig into the pinpoint areas I want to hit.

[Will Hunt]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a clue what this thread is about?

[tomtom]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a clue what this thread is about?

yes.

[Sasquatch]

Foam Rollin is basically using a big foam tube to self massage muscles.

Www.athletestreatingathletes.com has a good amount of info on self massage.

[Paul B]

I'm intrigued by this T-nation rant on using foam rollers too much and turning into wimps, does anyone actually use them as more than a very minor part of a work-out to break up stiff tissue before/during stretching?

I see people who are barely training doing corrective / mobility exercies (as training, not supplementing it) and it being pushed in a number of ways, yes. I can't comment on foam rolling specifically, but as I said above, this struck a chord with me.

Foam Rollin is basically using a big foam tube to self massage muscles.

Surprised at the lack of use on here. I thought they were well established. Got the whole range of this kind of kit in our house. Partner a physio. This is the bit I use the most. Mostly for back and shoulder stuff. 

Like Kinesio tape?

I'm genuinely interested to know if there's some SCIENCE to back up the rollin'.
+many foam rollers look like torture devices.

[Oldmanmatt]

Am I the only one who doesn't have a clue what this thread is about?

No.

At first glance of the title, I thought it was a decorating thread....

😉

[highrepute]

Surprised at the lack of use on here. I thought they were well established. Got the whole range of this kind of kit in our house. Partner a physio. This is the bit I use the most. Mostly for back and shoulder stuff. 

Like Kinesio tape?

I'm genuinely interested to know if there's some SCIENCE to back up the rollin'.
+many foam rollers look like torture devices.

Got kinesio tape too. Never used it tho. But i think the claims behind that are more extreme than foam rollers. I wouldn't place too much faith in science,  hasn't TomTom got a PhD and look at the crap he spouts

Re the foam roller: I use it to aid stretching and massage. There's plenty of "science" around them. But mostly it feels good and works for me.

[tomtom]

Got kinesio tape too. Never used it tho. But i think the claims behind that are more extreme than foam rollers. I wouldn't place too much faith in science,  hasn't TomTom got a PhD and look at the crap he spouts

:D Its how I made my career...

That tape has got to have placebo effects only surely...

*I had a couple of Molars out this morning so the 'crap spouting ometer(tm)' is at the top of the scale...

[chris j]

I see people who are barely training doing corrective / mobility exercies (as training, not supplementing it) and it being pushed in a number of ways, yes. I can't comment on foam rolling specifically, but as I said above, this struck a chord with me.

Do they have any training goals other than perfect posture and mobility? If so I can't imagine how anyone would believe rolling on a foam tube would be more effective than say actual training towards their goals, but people never fail to surprise me.
 

Foam Rollin is basically using a big foam tube to self massage muscles.

Like Sasquatch said, foam rolling to self-massage, for me to break up knotted muscle to aid stretching, I can't really imagine it being much good for anything else.

Had kinesio tape used on me once by a massage therapist, not sure why. I sported a pink stripe down my thigh for a day or two, no long term effect I could discern...

[Falling Down]

Like Sasquatch said, foam rolling to self-massage, for me to break up knotted muscle to aid stretching, I can't really imagine it being much good for anything else.

This.  It works a treat for me to soften up the upper back, shoulders and open up the spine.

[JJP]

I started using one for a lower/ mid back problem on the advice of a physio and it has worked really well.  Similar to others I also find it great for the upper back after climbing.

[Stubbs]

That latter paragraph really struck a cord with what I, hopefully including some SCIENCE?

There's a few papers knocking around, I recommend Google to search for your own SCIENCE! E.g.:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24343353/

[J.Kydd]

I've been using a roller for a couple of years now.
Coming from a background in biketrials, I was mainly focusing on my upper back/shoulders + quads after a long/intense ride. Particularly if I was going to be riding consecutive days

Since coming to the climbing world, I've found it's definitely helped alongside stretching to release tension in my ridiculously tight hip flexors + hamstrings

Mine is just a basic one from 66fit and it's been excellent
 http://www.physiosupplies.com/66fit-epp-foam-roller-black-15cm-x-45cm.html

[galpinos]

That latter paragraph really struck a cord with what I, hopefully including some SCIENCE?

There's a few papers knocking around, I recommend Google to search for your own SCIENCE! E.g.:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24343353/

I think Paul's larger point is a bit like yoga, powerballs etc. What are the relative benefits in your climbing ability of dicking around on a piece of foam to spnding that time training. Most of us have limited amount of training time (I'm not trsaining 30hrs a week) so are we using that time as efficiently as possible.

[Stubbs]

Comparing to yoga and powerballs isn't particularly appropriate as foam rolling is about aiding recovery following training, rather than as a supplement or replacement to any form of training.   It takes max 10 mins after a session, even if you aren't training 30 hrs a week, as FD said before, most people can find 10 mins before getting into bed to have a bit of a roll!

Studies that I've seen seem to suggest that it aids recovery and decreases muscle soreness, sounds like a good use of 10 mins to me!

[tomtom]

Anyway.. Looking at Aldi's website it seems these were one of their specials a few weeks back - so you'll be lucky to find some... Assuming they sell like hot cakes/discounted prosecco

[fatdoc]

Comparing to yoga and powerballs isn't particularly appropriate as foam rolling is about aiding recovery following training, rather than as a supplement or replacement to any form of training.   It takes max 10 mins after a session, even if you aren't training 30 hrs a week, as FD said before, most people can find 10 mins before getting into bed to have a bit of a roll!

Studies that I've seen seem to suggest that it aids recovery and decreases muscle soreness, sounds like a good use of 10 mins to me!

Agreed. I'm a big fan, when I can MTFU and go through the pain....

[Paul B]

There's a few papers knocking around, I recommend Google to search for your own SCIENCE! E.g.:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/24343353/

I will do, I'll then make sure to write it up on the Wiki so there's no need to discuss it in the future 

Being less flippant; some people on here are fairly clued up with things like this and the surrounding SCIENCE, I was hoping for that kind of input (likely due to laziness).

[Stubbs]

There only seems to have been small studies done on the science front, but anecdotally just from UKB users they seem to be popular and effective. If I remember to use mine on my shoulders after a board sesh I notice the reduction in soreness the next day, using them on my legs after cycling is very painful, but very effective at reducing soreness also.

As I said, <ten fuck alls for a roller and 10 mins of your time before bed, doesn't seem to be that much to lose in trying out your own n=1 study!

[Muenchener]

Todd Hargrove of bettermovement.org

There is very limited evidence about what benefit, if any, foam rolling confers. But there are at least a few studies showing that it leads to short term increases in range of motion that are not accompanied by strength loss. (This is interesting because stretching interventions tend to show increased range of motion that are associated with a loss of strength and power.)

I use one as part of my recovery/mobility routine, mostly on forearms and calves before stretching them.

[Paul B]

As I said, <ten fuck alls for a roller and 10 mins of your time before bed, doesn't seem to be that much to lose in trying out your own n=1 study!

Given the UKB response I probably will be purchasing one shortly. I noticed someone carrying one for Camille Le Blanc Bazinet the other day so that's enough for me. 

[mctrials23]

A lot of top athletes have sport massage regularly to help recovery and to iron out any muscular issues so I don't know how people can say that a foam roller is pointless. I have tight calves, hamstrings and quads but if I foam roller them a lot before a run I don't have any issues. If I don't I wreck them for about a week.

[Paul B]

Likewise I can't see how people can say Accapi helped their performance... but they do.  /flippant

People tend to jump on bandwagons (myself included). However, the masses of UKB have spoken!

[webbo]

I've been using a roller for a couple of years now.
Coming from a background in biketrials, I was mainly focusing on my upper back/shoulders + quads after a long/intense ride. Particularly if I was going to be riding consecutive days

Since coming to the climbing world, I've found it's definitely helped alongside stretching to release tension in my ridiculously tight hip flexors + hamstrings

Mine is just a basic one from 66fit and it's been excellent
 http://www.physiosupplies.com/66fit-epp-foam-roller-black-15cm-x-45cm.html

Thanks for the heads up for this supplier, I found as I own my own nurses outfit I could registrar as a Professional and get up to 50% discount.

[erm, sam]

I'm with Sasquatch. Lacross balls are the future. I use a lacross ball much more than a foam roller, it is amazing after a bouldering session to de tighten the back and scap muscles etc. I mostly use a foam roller to warm up my back before using a lacross ball peanut (two lacross balls taped together) to do the central back muscles and then a single lacross ball to beast the scap/rhombus muscles to oblivion. They end up much less tight and I think I have less stiffness the next day. Buy three and you will never look back.

[Sasquatch]

a lacross ball peanut (two lacross balls taped together)

genius!!!! i'm getting two more lacrosse balls tomorrow.

[chris j]

I'm using these http://www.66fit.com/66fit-acupressure-trigger-point-massage-balls.html as well as the roller at the moment - great for getting in deep to break up knots the roller can't touch. Similar to the lacrosse ball in size, comes in a set of 3 of different densities for ~ £8 from Amazon (other supplies are available etc).

[Monolith]

It was a while back when they came in beast, just after new year I think. I bought mine last night, it wasn't the last one in the shop either. Might be worth taking the Lexus around the ring road and finding another Aldi, or getting others in other areas to put out their feelers for you...

Very surprisingly managed to pick one up for 6 point 99 fuck alls in Aldi, St Johns yesterday. Already feeling like a newborn baby from rolling, good shout Andy!

[andy_e]

Are we forgetting the fuck-all to £ exchange rate or has it changed? 1 fuck-all = £2.50 therefore the roller cost you 2.8 fuck-alls... Glad to be of assistance Mr. Mills!

[TheTwig]

I got a rumbleroller (fairly hard with big spikes!) for like £30 a few years back. Some of the best money I ever spent. Before I had it I had a really bad lower back due to bad posture as a teenager and always had extremely tight muscles that knotted up. I roll my back and as much of my shoulder area as possible. Lying on your side you can do the sides of shoulders and biceps nicely, as well as calfs, hamstrings, quads etc etc etc. All in all foam rollers are amazing 

[dr_botnik]

3.99 in addition atm, foam rollers and expertise balls, or there were in the one at the Darnall turn off from Sheffield parkway.

[dr_botnik]

3.99 in addition atm, foam rollers and expertise balls, or there were in the one at the Darnall turn off from Sheffield parkway.

I meant aldi dammit. Apparently you can just cut a piece of pipe up if your really skint.

[BobbyBear]

Suffering from years of road rage /desk job posture my traps are badly knotted up. A physio nearly passed out when I told her I'd been using a golf ball. So got a ball and roller from here https://www.tptherapy.com/about/our-story about six months ago and has worked a treat. Used regular durinh warm down frees up the muscles that the stretches can't get too. £50ish all in. May sound a lot but beats £50 a go for a sports massage.

Don't get me wrong the full workout using them holds no interest, but for rehab it works well.

[Paul B]

His last point does ring worryingly true (paraphrasing): "if you don't take care of yourself it WILL catch up with you"... I have thought I'm 29 now and my body responds very differently (more negatively) to training to how it did when I was in my early 20s. What in Gods name will it be like in another 10,20 etc. years?

I wish I'd ordered the foam roller when I last posted on here as my back improved but steadily seems to be declining. It seems more linked to desk-posture than climbing though (or I keep trying to believe that).

[dave]

I have thought I'm 29 now and my body responds very differently (more negatively) to training to how it did when I was in my early 20s. What in Gods name will it be like in another 10,20 etc. years?

Given your general level of luck I wouldn't waste too much effort worrying about 20yrs in the future.

[Nibile]

I have thought I'm 29 now and my body responds very differently (more negatively) to training to how it did when I was in my early 20s. What in Gods name will it be like in another 10,20 etc. years?

Hmmm... I'm 43 now and I'm in the best shape of my life, so I wouldn't worry.
The biggest difference is that my sessions must be short, sometimes very short, but intensity haven't decreased.
Plus, with age you are cooler with the girls.

[finbarrr]

Hmmm... I'm 43 now and I'm in the best shape of my life, so I wouldn't worry.
The biggest difference is that my sessions must be short, sometimes very short, but intensity haven't decreased.
Plus, with age you are cooler with the girls women.

 

[Nibile]

 
That should tell a lot about my mental age...