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RIP - free speech? (Read 28292 times)

lagerstarfish

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#25 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 12:36:43 am
I've never been able to work out whether she grasped Hayek's 70's economic theories because they were the strongest ideas available or because they fitted her preconceptions - I like to think that with her scientific background it was the former - However, from what I remember, Hayek kept updating his ideas in the tradition of the western scientific method - shame Thatcher couldn't do the same - possibly because she was stuck in our version of democracy which ultimately favoured the likes of Blair who just sought immediate popularity rather than being right (I mean "correct" rather than "right wing")

As far as I'm concerned, we need a a good, strong socialist dictatorship with me at the helm - we'll be united in our efforts to fight against bad bacteria, viruses, laziness, bigotry and asteroids - that should keep us going for a couple of hundred years while we work out the right way to run things

hard to know which thread to post in

in summary; free speech is OK as long as you listen to what I say and take time to realise that I am right - other ideas (especially evidence based stuff) are useful too, obviously, as I am quite prepared to change my opinion - you should just trust my judgement for a while. too many cooks and all that
« Last Edit: April 09, 2013, 12:49:34 am by lagerstarfish »

slackline

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#26 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 06:38:13 am
Thatcher's policies were instrumental in creating a country where the majority are too disenfranchised/uneducated to bother voting. Hence, the elitist morons in some form or other will forever rule.

In that regards this is an interesting read...

Margaret Thatcher: Still More Alive Than She Herself Dared To Dream

aLICErOBERTSfANkLUB

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#27 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 07:00:30 am
Thought police

Huh?

OK, what have I missed?

iain

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#28 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 08:42:22 am
OK, what have I missed?
Some short lived censorship, (which I didn't agree with btw,) nothing to see now.

I don't know which thread to post in either. Anyway,
Hence, the elitist morons in some form or other will forever rule.
That's the problem regardless of who you vote for.

Unless it's lagers, when do you start your campaign?

Fultonius

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#29 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 01:24:45 pm


As far as I'm concerned, we need a a good, strong socialist dictatorship with me at the helm - we'll be united in our efforts to fight against bad bacteria, viruses, laziness, bigotry and asteroids - that should keep us going for a couple of hundred years while we work out the right way to run things



Benevolent dictatorship with Lagers at the helm? Hell Yeah, where do I sign up??

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#30 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 01:32:27 pm
If your campaign features this, plus no tax on fish or lager, you already have my vote.

Jaspersharpe

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#31 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 01:50:57 pm
Thatcher's policies were instrumental in creating a country where the majority are too disenfranchised/uneducated to bother voting. Hence, the elitist morons in some form or other will forever rule.

In that regards this is an interesting read...

Margaret Thatcher: Still More Alive Than She Herself Dared To Dream

That's a cracking article.

Nibile

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#32 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 02:39:05 pm
I grew up in a family in which The Iron Lady was one of my father's heroes, and I never had the chance or the desire to deeply analyze her acts and her policies. I know that somehow she managed to solve soccer hooligans' issue, and that for me, being Italian, is a great accomplishment.
I don't know much more, beside the Falklands war.
So, I really did not expect such a strong reaction over her death, such happiness.
I have realized that for sure little did I truly know about her.
Despite some feelings that I can't understand, her death really opened my eyes and made some things more clear.
Thank you all for opinions, comments and links.

metal arms

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#33 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 02:50:34 pm
This is bullshit.  No pastry or Anasazi option.  Is it a poll tax?

Hoseyb

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#34 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:00:50 pm
As Someone who was 5 at the start of her term I find all these weird feelings on her passing, all the hate songs by Costello and Hefner etc written during her life seem way off the mark for the event. Its just a feeling of waste.

My Dad posted a quote on facebook that seemed to fit my mood best:

"I will mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy". - Martin Luther King Jr

Jaspersharpe

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#35 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:14:18 pm
I know that somehow she managed to solve soccer hooligans' issue, and that for me, being Italian, is a great accomplishment.


A widely held misconception largely due to the lies of the right wing press both at the time and since.....

http://www.wsc.co.uk/wsc-daily/1161-april-2013/9635-how-margaret-thatcher-influenced-football

http://www.theweek.co.uk/football/margaret-thatcher/52388/margaret-thatcher-football-not-mourn-death

etc

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#36 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:18:35 pm
Though I can't help wondering if the same have happened if Bono (and his hat) karked it in a plane crash... ;)

Would be lovely irony if he was flying to a climate change conference when it happened.

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#37 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:24:15 pm
I've been trying to think of some genuine positives as a result of thatcher's rule. This sketch is about the best I could come up with.


SA Chris

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#38 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:29:48 pm
My Dad posted a quote on facebook that seemed to fit my mood best:

"I will mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy". - Martin Luther King Jr

An admirable sentiment and one I wish I could share.

rich d

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#39 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:52:08 pm
I was born in 72 in Leeds so definitely a child of the thatcher era and have hazy memories of the power cuts before she came to power. I think that the country was seriously broken when she came to power and needed some radical changes. For me she was a great dismantler unfortunately nothing was ever put in place to replace what was dismantled. I never had any time for the miners. Leed's textile industry vanished and no-one gave it government subsidies or funding to keep it in place - yet the city recovered and found alternate jobs. The miners struck me as being stuck in an economic past that was coming to an end. Scargill didn't hold a ballot, and took them out during the spring (when demand for coal was low and they power stations had huge stockpiles) for what felt like political power reasons. I've always thought that the miner's strike wasn't a heroic battle for worker's rights - but a misguided political decision to try and pull down another democratically elected government - that failed due to incompetent leadership. Is Thatcher to blame for banker's greed and the individualist society? Who knows? Seems like an easy bogey-woman to blame, there's always been greed on the right and the left and probably always will be. I vote for lager's benign dictatorship (although it does worry me that dense may have some form of roll in the lager junta)

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#40 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:52:49 pm
I know that somehow she managed to solve soccer hooligans' issue, and that for me, being Italian, is a great accomplishment.


A widely held misconception largely due to the lies of the right wing press both at the time and since.....

http://www.wsc.co.uk/wsc-daily/1161-april-2013/9635-how-margaret-thatcher-influenced-football

http://www.theweek.co.uk/football/margaret-thatcher/52388/margaret-thatcher-football-not-mourn-death

etc
Very interesting, thanks.

Jaspersharpe

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#41 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 03:56:12 pm
I vote for lager's benign dictatorship (although it does worry me that dense may have some form of roll in the lager junta)

He's lined up for a PR role.

rich d

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#42 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 04:08:43 pm
Thatcher did nothing positive for football from an English perspective. The availability of good quality E's had more of an effect on reducing and side-lining football hooliganism than her policies. 

SamT

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#43 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 09:57:34 pm
Thatcher did nothing positive for football from an English perspective. The availability of good quality E's had more of an effect on reducing and side-lining football hooliganism than her policies.

Dad commented today that he noticed that Man U were NOT wearing black arm bands nor a minutes silence or owt like that which often happens at matches when notable folk kark it  (not that I know - dont really watch football).

tomtom

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#44 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 10:45:39 pm
I grew up in a family in which The Iron Lady was one of my father's heroes, and I never had the chance or the desire to deeply analyze her acts and her policies. I know that somehow she managed to solve soccer hooligans' issue, and that for me, being Italian, is a great accomplishment.

Nothing to do with Thatcher - its a chemical solution. Its widely believed that these solved it:


E's became the matchday enhancer of choice.. and with it the less agressive than alcohol side effects...


tomtom

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#45 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 09, 2013, 10:46:45 pm
Thatcher did nothing positive for football from an English perspective. The availability of good quality E's had more of an effect on reducing and side-lining football hooliganism than her policies.

Sorry - posted the above before seeing Rich's post.. +1

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#46 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 10, 2013, 07:02:11 am
Ah! I really did not know this!

crimp

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#47 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 10, 2013, 02:36:21 pm
Hi fiend.

I take my smitings with good grace.

But in reply to being smited because the moderators have a right to crack down on political spite, i would say this.

They should clamp down on racism, sexism, homophobia, and all forms of discrimination, bullying, threats of violence etc.

But political spite? So all political satire cartoons, sketches, etc are to be outlawed?

You had best smite everyone posting in cunt of the year thread. It's overflowing with political spite.

We're not talking about people picking on the weak here.

I can see where habrich his coming from with his stated personal situation, but i am sure he understands the context, and knows none of it is personal.

Regards

underground

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#48 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 14, 2013, 02:49:29 am
I'm generally one to not think too much about politics etc, I'm just going with the flow and letting those with the passion and time to consider sort it out. I also find football complete anathema, but reading those articles, all I think is this: in a game, men kicking a ball and those who do it better 'win', why all the hatred? 'Poor ticket management' in Heysel a reason for the riot that killed people? What is it with football that it has to be 'we hate those QPR cunts' etc? Other than the stadium being filled with angry horrible morons I just don't get it. In fact the 'QPR cunts' ting I've heard from a well standing, intelligent, good friend, but I guess someone who wouldn't wield a Stanley knife in anger.

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#49 Re: RIP - free speech?
April 14, 2013, 03:15:23 am
The best and worst thing about this forum is the oppressive consensus on many subjects. For climbing, and a few other practical topics, that works well: keeps idiots away. On politics ... personally I wish people would vent elsewhere and leave ukb politics-free. Especially the one or two who don't contribute anything else to this place. I am not alone with that wish ... others have said it to me directly.

Nothing to do with the fact that your politics is not in line with that consensus? I'm sure I'm less bothered as I'm closer to it, but I do think it'd be healthier (or at least make for more informative reading) if the debate on here had more input from those to the right of the average UKBer - FD, yourself, ummm, haven't really picked up on others politics - and perhaps the consensus would then feel less oppressive? Certainly wouldn't want people to feel they couldn't discuss politics on here.

Bring back Sloper.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2013, 03:40:12 am by Duma »

 

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