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No longer taboo to ask for proof ? (Read 86522 times)

a dense loner

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#200 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 10:17:36 am
What utter rubbish

dave

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#201 No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 10:27:43 am
I knew you'd say that.

petejh

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#202 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 10:59:45 am
Nemo why don't we need proof off John but we do off others? I'm intrigued

It's not that we don't 'need' proof of Gaskin's beastliness (who 'needs' proof - 'would like', yes). I think it's more the case that it's an impossibility for there to be any conclusive proof unless Gaskins decides to do the problems again and also vids/witness them. Whereas in more recent cases, having no witnesses and no video is much more unusual. Due in part to threads like this and others.
One of the main points coming out of this thread is that a lot of people agree that it's desirable to create an environment in which it's harder to thrive as a liar, compared to the 90's/noughties (and earlier). Anything that's gone before is water under the bridge, but going forward if the culture has shifted, which it look like it is doing, then hopefully there'll be less incentive for doubtful or unproven 'hardest probs/routes/biggest wads in the country' because part of the incentive, recognition, is removed. That to me seems like a good thing to aspire to if it results in fewer ridiculous situations like Simpson/ the hardest boulder probs in the UK being completely unknown quantities.

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#203 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 11:19:22 am
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confirmed bullshitters (Si O aside as he's a mental) always seem to manage to cash-in

How many bullshitters have actually been 'confirmed'? I'd say only two - Simpson and Si 'O, though Simpson was clearly strong enough to do some of what his claimed, and the Kentmere thread above would actually seem to add to Si 'O's credibility with Gaskins confirming his grades. Other who have been called out seem to have largely weathered the doubt. So for those of us who would like to form an opinion other than 'mu', its clear as mud.

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#204 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 12:05:52 pm
I'd say at least 3  :worms:

Doylo

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#205 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 12:17:49 pm
I ve encountered a few over the years!

a dense loner

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#206 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 01:37:57 pm
No bullshitters have been confirmed, you can't confirm anything after the fact. Loads of people on here, the majority, thought Simpson was the real deal. A few people called him out, so to speak, loads on here were defending him to the hilt, saying stuff like I saw him do x I saw him do y I know someone who belayed him on z. Myself and a few others got a bit of flak over this. Even the marathon and the boxing didn't persuade people, only when the Brandler- hasse story came out did everyone jump on the bandwagon and say what a bullshitter he was, and take every oppurtunity to bring his name up in these cases. So I'm sorry if someone who many people who saw him over many times doing mutant stuff, cos he was in a different league strength wise, turns out to be doubted, or as a confirmed bullshitter yet someone who has been seen to do nx to nothing yet has a cult following of people who claim his stuff to be among the hardest problems in the world gets a free pass. Absolute madness is what all this reads as

Monolith

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#207 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 02:12:13 pm
The Gaskins Inquiry.

willackers

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#208 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 02:27:20 pm
 Everyone knows you go straight to hell if you bad mouth Gaskins  :devil-smiley:

Bonjoy

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#209 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 02:33:53 pm
Fact is nobody had the gumption/balls to sort the matter out one way or the other at the time and now it will remain forever moot. That's pretty much it. Unless new stuff comes to light I can't see much point chewing over the Gaskins thing now. Anyone who pretends they know all his stuff is either fact or fiction is kidding themselves and fooling few others. Take the lessons and move on. Gaskins is and will always be an unknown quantity.

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#210 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 06:04:43 pm
Don't know or care what Simpson climbed or not, but it was proven that he didn't run the marathon or the 4 minute mile as claimed, or that he was close to the Olympic boxing squad, as was claimed. It was also obvious from his published "write up" that he had never been to the Cima Grande di Lavaredo, contrary to his claims to have have done at least 4 big climbs on that face. He also claimed to have climbed a number of routes, none of which he cared or was able to name a belayer for. As a result of all this only a fool would credit him with any ascent unless incontrovertible proof were supplied, and quite rightly so.

I also don't know what Gaskins has climbed or not. It just seems that by and large, there seems to be a lot of talk of his problems being too hard (for the grade and absolutely) but when they see a repeat they mostly check out. In fact, rather than no-one being good enough to do his problems, I am unaware of any claims that there is anything unusual about them.

Unlike some other boulderers he seems to have preferred to do local problems, on his own, and back in the day did not bother videoing his climbs. Nothing wrong with any of that, in my view. I rather feel that its a bit of good fortune that anything is known about him at all.

I personally I have no more doubt about his FAs than most claimed hard ascents in the history of climbing.

petejh

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#211 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 13, 2013, 06:11:42 pm
 :agree: Sort of.  Good comparison.


Have Gaskins, Si O'Connor and Simpson ever been seen together in the same place?

Thought not.  :-\ The plot thickens...

Bonjoy

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#212 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 14, 2013, 08:50:06 am
You can make a sketchy case either way. What’s the point? There isn’t enough info to make a strong case either way, so it’s all just statements of faith. Both sides cases have merit, neither has more weight than the other. Which side people fall on seems more to do with them and their world view than the merits of the evidence. Why can’t people just accept this is an unanswerable question, it’s a maybe rather than a yes or no? Mu, mu, sad but true.

shark

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#213 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 14, 2013, 11:07:17 am
You can make a sketchy case either way. What’s the point? There isn’t enough info to make a strong case either way, so it’s all just statements of faith. Both sides cases have merit, neither has more weight than the other. Which side people fall on seems more to do with them and their world view than the merits of the evidence. Why can’t people just accept this is an unanswerable question, it’s a maybe rather than a yes or no? Mu, mu, sad but true.

I agree. Still worth encouraging people to share what they have seen him do for the record.

Bonjoy

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#214 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 14, 2013, 11:19:59 am
Of course. The more info the better.

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#215 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 02:29:55 am
I'd say this is the perfect example of how useful uncut footage can be, especially for climbers coming off the competition circuit who don't have the benefit of a season of hard outdoor sends to their name because of that time commitment. 



Absolutely unquestionable and very easy for the climber to film. Great effort by GG too!

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#216 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 09:22:03 am
No bullshitters have been confirmed, you can't confirm anything after the fact. Loads of people on here, the majority, thought Simpson was the real deal. A few people called him out, so to speak, loads on here were defending him to the hilt, saying stuff like I saw him do x I saw him do y I know someone who belayed him on z. Myself and a few others got a bit of flak over this. Even the marathon and the boxing didn't persuade people, only when the Brandler- hasse story came out did everyone jump on the bandwagon and say what a bullshitter he was, and take every oppurtunity to bring his name up in these cases. So I'm sorry if someone who many people who saw him over many times doing mutant stuff, cos he was in a different league strength wise, turns out to be doubted, or as a confirmed bullshitter yet someone who has been seen to do nx to nothing yet has a cult following of people who claim his stuff to be among the hardest problems in the world gets a free pass. Absolute madness is what all this reads as

Ever thought about learning English, Dense?

Jaspersharpe

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#217 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 11:09:37 am
I'd say this is the perfect example of how useful uncut footage can be, especially for climbers coming off the competition circuit who don't have the benefit of a season of hard outdoor sends to their name because of that time commitment. 

I don't get you. This guy has loads of witnessed and filmed quick hard ascents (e.g) to his name plus everyone has seen what a total monster he is on the comp circuit. Surely the perfect example of someone who has absolutely no need for video evidence of every hard problem he does (and he had at least one witness there too)?
 :shrug:

yankcranker

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#218 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 12:13:17 pm
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Lying makes no sense to me unless you’re weak and have alot to prove. Strong climbers are strong fact.

Although this would seem to be counter to the most notorious recent case. Why is Britain so obsessed with using the term 'strong' instead of 'good'? As dense will tell you, being strong is barely half the story...

lol, dude overuse of the word "strong" is hardly a british phenomenon. what really tickles me is when its used to describe a climber with the BMI of your average pre-adolescent girl.

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#219 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 04:08:36 pm
[lol, dude overuse of the word "strong" is hardly a british phenomenon. what really tickles me is when its used to describe a climber with the BMI of your average pre-adolescent girl.
I agree, most american climbers seem to be pretty scrawny, apart from that carlo traversi, I saw him in Swiss, he was a right porker, incredible he could do anything, let alone font 8c.

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#220 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 04:17:06 pm
I'd say this is the perfect example of how useful uncut footage can be, especially for climbers coming off the competition circuit who don't have the benefit of a season of hard outdoor sends to their name because of that time commitment. 

I don't get you. This guy has loads of witnessed and filmed quick hard ascents (e.g) to his name plus everyone has seen what a total monster he is on the comp circuit. Surely the perfect example of someone who has absolutely no need for video evidence of every hard problem he does (and he had at least one witness there too)?
 :shrug:

Sorry my point was a bit convoluted there. Mainly that a video like that was so easy to film and post online and it provides completely unchallengable evidence of his accent, as well as being thoroughly entertaining.  I wasn't familiar with his climbing outside this years competition circuit but I'm sure he is a beast as you said.

SA Chris

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#221 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 17, 2013, 08:54:45 pm
unchallengable evidence of his accent

Well you can definitely hear his spotter is French! :)

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#222 Re: No longer taboo to ask for proof ?
January 18, 2013, 07:55:40 am
No bullshitters have been confirmed, you can't confirm anything after the fact. Loads of people on here, the majority, thought Simpson was the real deal. A few people called him out, so to speak, loads on here were defending him to the hilt, saying stuff like I saw him do x I saw him do y I know someone who belayed him on z. Myself and a few others got a bit of flak over this. Even the marathon and the boxing didn't persuade people, only when the Brandler- hasse story came out did everyone jump on the bandwagon and say what a bullshitter he was, and take every oppurtunity to bring his name up in these cases. So I'm sorry if someone who many people who saw him over many times doing mutant stuff, cos he was in a different league strength wise, turns out to be doubted, or as a confirmed bullshitter yet someone who has been seen to do nx to nothing yet has a cult following of people who claim his stuff to be among the hardest problems in the world gets a free pass. Absolute madness is what all this reads as

Ever thought about learning English, Dense?

Makes perfect sense though .........

 

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