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RIP (Read 461331 times)

SA Chris

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#750 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 12:43:07 pm
Or you could just see it at the bottom of the previous page :)

GraemeA

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#751 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 12:52:13 pm
But total respect for a man prepared to think though his ethics clearly and be prepared to take a stand for them.

Ken calling competition climbers "barbarians"* and that as a consequence of the BMC supporting comps The Nose# would be bolted within a few years is hardly well thought out ethics.

Documented in the AC Journal 1993.

* he was referring to people like Fliss Butler
# I assume he meant Dinas Mot

Will Hunt

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#752 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 12:56:59 pm
Or you could just see it at the bottom of the previous page :)

Oh aye. Didn't clock the non-embedded one.

http://footlesscrow.blogspot.co.uk/2015/01/ken-wilsonthe-man-who-gave-us-mountain.html

Johnny Brown

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#753 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 01:29:07 pm
But total respect for a man prepared to think though his ethics clearly and be prepared to take a stand for them.

Ken calling competition climbers "barbarians"* and that as a consequence of the BMC supporting comps The Nose# would be bolted within a few years is hardly well thought out ethics.

Documented in the AC Journal 1993.

* he was referring to people like Fliss Butler
# I assume he meant Dinas Mot

So with hindsight, some of his predictions turned out to be wrong. There are still bolts in the mountains today in places most of us would never have dreamed of (Brown slabs, Broad stand) and the wedge is still being pushed.

It doesn't mean his ethics weren't clearly thought out. His basic argument against bolts is a valid as ever, although now for many climbers it's more akin to a category error. But let's not mark this by getting into a bolt debate.

Will Hunt

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#754 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 01:46:13 pm
So with hindsight, some of his predictions turned out to be wrong. There are still bolts in the mountains today in places most of us would never have dreamed of (Brown slabs, Broad stand) and the wedge is still being pushed.

Is that correct? Where is the bolt on Broad Stand? There's an in situ chain/tat station at the top of Crowley's Direct which people use to abseil to Mickledore but this is a world away from a bolt.

GraemeA

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#755 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 02:50:15 pm
It wasn't a bolt debate, it was a comps debate. My point of ill thought out was that calling Fliss a barbarian is downright silly.

Respect due though particularly for Mountain and Classic/Hard/Extreme Rock.

And also for the purple Font guide.

Johnny Brown

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#756 Re: RIP
June 13, 2016, 02:51:52 pm
So with hindsight, some of his predictions turned out to be wrong. There are still bolts in the mountains today in places most of us would never have dreamed of (Brown slabs, Broad stand) and the wedge is still being pushed.

Is that correct? Where is the bolt on Broad Stand? There's an in situ chain/tat station at the top of Crowley's Direct which people use to abseil to Mickledore but this is a world away from a bolt.

My bad, they've been removed. The point stands that they were installed at all though.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=358401

DAVETHOMAS90

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#757 Re: RIP
June 14, 2016, 01:47:40 am
So with hindsight, some of his predictions turned out to be wrong. There are still bolts in the mountains today in places most of us would never have dreamed of (Brown slabs, Broad stand) and the wedge is still being pushed.

Is that correct? Where is the bolt on Broad Stand? There's an in situ chain/tat station at the top of Crowley's Direct which people use to abseil to Mickledore but this is a world away from a bolt.

My bad, they've been removed. The point stands that they were installed at all though.
http://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/t.php?t=358401

Yes, the point stands.

It's really quite shocking how quickly he's gone. Ken so clearly loved his climbing with an endless passion.  I think he was always trying to celebrate what was at the heart of it.

It only seems like two years ago that he was in fine form, describing his next project, "VS Rock" which would have been tremendous. We'll all reach a point where that one would have had something for us to enjoy!

I remember walking through Bristol with a rope on my back, 30 odd years ago, and being "rescued" and offered a doss by a local climber who happened to be passing. I found The Games Climbers Play on his bookshelf, and couldn't put it down. Hard Rock is oozing with history and magic, and will remain one of the best reminders of what I love about climbing.

tregiffian

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#758 Re: RIP
June 14, 2016, 02:12:42 am
I once slept on his office floor after the pub before a long drive. He was a good guy.

duncan

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#759 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 01:17:39 pm
Excellent Ken Wilson tribute from Ed Douglas in Alpinist, a journalist and a magazine that both owe a huge debt to him.


Photo: Chris Bonnington


andy popp

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#760 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 04:24:40 pm
Yes, me ... just. Webbo certainly?

Muenchener

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#761 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 05:06:06 pm
Oh yes we are.

Oldmanmatt

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#762 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 05:40:36 pm
Jo Cox MP dead after shooting attack
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304


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andy popp

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#763 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 05:50:54 pm
Jo Cox MP dead after shooting attack
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-36550304


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This is such a grave and disturbing development.

Will Hunt

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#764 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 05:52:39 pm
At the risk of detracting from the terrible news about Jo Cox, what possesed you to turn down such an opportunity?

Neil F

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#765 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 09:23:27 pm
Little known fact: I was once asked if I wanted to edit Mountain.

That's funny Andy.  So was I!

Ken tracked me down to Jon de Montjoye's chalet in the alps where I was on holiday.  I seem to remember I was somewhat taken aback, but he was clearly desperate, having already been turned down by at least one luminary....!

I declined the offer, and Mountain sadly folded within a matter of weeks.

Neil

andy popp

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#766 Re: RIP
June 16, 2016, 09:33:29 pm
Little known fact: I was once asked if I wanted to edit Mountain.

That's funny Andy.  So was I!

Ken tracked me down to Jon de Montjoye's chalet in the alps where I was on holiday.  I seem to remember I was somewhat taken aback, but he was clearly desperate, having already been turned down by at least one luminary....!

I declined the offer, and Mountain sadly folded within a matter of weeks.

Neil

I was asked by Paul Nunn (who I worked with at the time) but it was clearly in the same period as it went under shortly after. Sadly the magazine was already almost on the ropes, which is why I declined.

Neil F

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#767 Re: RIP
June 17, 2016, 12:34:09 pm

Yes, I am talking 1991.

No, Ken hadn't bought Mountain back.  It was owned by Paul Nunn at that time.

What I suspect happened is that Paul mentioned to Ken that the magazine was struggling, and may need to close, and Ken offered to see if he could help in any practical way.  I'm certainly sure he wouldn't have wanted to see his creation bite the dust, but equally I don't think he would have ever bought it back and try to run it himself.

What I can't remember is why they suddenly needed to find a new Editor.  Wasn't Bernard editing it at that time?  I have a full set at home, so it wouldn't be hard to look that up.

Anyway, I'm not sure how much help Ken was on that occasion, if he thought people like me were capable of editing Mountain....

Neil

« Last Edit: September 21, 2022, 12:29:35 pm by shark »

andy popp

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#768 Re: RIP
June 17, 2016, 12:43:17 pm
... if he thought people like me were capable of editing Mountain....

I think it was the fact that Paul had been reduced to asking me that really convinced me the whole thing was doomed and I should say no.

tc

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#769 Re: RIP
June 30, 2016, 02:10:39 pm
I'm not sure I've ever met anyone so passionate about climbing. A sad loss.

I've just heard about this. A sad loss indeed. Our Ken was one of a kind. I'll miss the cantankerous old bugger.

Fultonius

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#770 Re: RIP
June 30, 2016, 03:08:55 pm
I feel slightly bad that the man's death prompted me to find a second hand copy of Games Climbers Play....but I'm glad I did. Lot's of interesting essays.

tomtom

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#771 Re: RIP
July 01, 2016, 08:52:55 am
The 20 000 people (or more) who died 100 years ago today in the Somme.

Only a part of the wholesale slaughter of WWI, but a poignant time for me (and our family) as my Grandfather went over the top - and was one of 4, from 400 - who made if back from his regiment. I'm here due to the chain of fate leading from his survival, and this makes me think about the other lives, families, peoples worlds were snuffed out then.

Muenchener

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#772 Re: RIP
July 01, 2016, 10:15:03 am
Yeah. My dear late gran had an astonishing number of friends who were single - there weren't any young men left for them to marry.

SA Chris

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#773 Re: RIP
July 01, 2016, 11:04:23 am
I'm here due to the chain of fate leading from his survival, and this makes me think about the other lives, families, peoples worlds were snuffed out then.

I'm fortunate too, my grandfather had kids relatively young by today's standards, he had 2 daughters before he died, aged 31.

Muenchener

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#774 Re: RIP
July 01, 2016, 01:07:17 pm
Quote from: Siegfried Sassoon
Aftermath
 
Have you forgotten yet?...   
For the world's events have rumbled on since those gagged days,   
Like traffic checked a while at the crossing of city ways:   
And the haunted gap in your mind has filled with thoughts that flow   
Like clouds in the lit heavens of life; and you're a man reprieved to go,
Taking your peaceful share of Time, with joy to spare.   
But the past is just the same,—and War's a bloody game....   
Have you forgotten yet?...   
Look down, and swear by the slain of the War that you'll never forget.   
 
Do you remember the dark months you held the sector at Mametz,—
The nights you watched and wired and dug and piled sandbags on parapets?   
Do you remember the rats; and the stench   
Of corpses rotting in front of the front-line trench,—   
And dawn coming, dirty-white, and chill with a hopeless rain?   
Do you ever stop and ask, "Is it all going to happen again?"
 
Do you remember that hour of din before the attack,—   
And the anger, the blind compassion that seized and shook you then   
As you peered at the doomed and haggard faces of your men?   
Do you remember the stretcher-cases lurching back   
With dying eyes and lolling heads, those ashen-grey
Masks of the lads who once were keen and kind and gay?   
 
Have you forgotten yet?...   
Look up, and swear by the green of the Spring that you'll never forget.


Not as much remembered these days as Wilfred Owen, perhaps for the sin of surviving, but this has always been one of my favourites.

 

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