[Falling Down]

Highlights said he crashed at 65kph and left a 100m skid mark on the Tarmac 

[Stubbs]

Do you think it was a hollow victory for Wiggins then? Contador banned, Schleck injured and Froome following team orders in 2012?

At least this year the main contenders made it to the start line.

Of course not, Bradley is British so entirely different rules apply, he also had the advantage of having his biggest GC threat on a radio controlled leash!

I'm waiting for Horner to get a special delivery and bring some of that magic from last years's giro!

[iain]

Highlights said he crashed at 65kph and left a 100m skid mark on the Tarmac 

Saw that, I can't believe he cycled over another cat 1 with a broken leg before he stopped. Utterly mental and grimly inspiring at the same time.

[north_country_boy]

Not Spartacus as well....
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cancellara-pulls-out-of-tour-de-france

19 riders have now withdrawn in 10 stages, hopefully that was the early rush and the majority now make it to Paris.

[webbo]

Call me an old cynic but we seem to have a Yellow jersey holder who barely seems to get out of breath whilst riding everyone off his wheel. Where have I seen that before.

[tomtom]

Call me an old cynic but we seem to have a Yellow jersey holder who barely seems to get out of breath whilst riding everyone off his wheel. Where have I seen that before.

Last year...   though to be fair Froome had a few moments where he seemed human - Nibs hasn't so far - maybe he's not been pushed enough. I'm sure someone somewhere is measuring his VO max blah blah and working out pro and against arguments...

[205Chris]

Call me an old cynic but we seem to have a Yellow jersey holder who barely seems to get out of breath whilst riding everyone off his wheel. Where have I seen that before.

I do hope there's nothing suspicious going on. Unfortunately most of the people who would be taking the fight to Nibali (Froome, Contador, Quintana etc.) are out or didn't start.

[rossydoodle61]

I found myself in the same situation watching the last 10km of stage 14. It's such a shame that when Nibali brilliantly powered away up that climb at the end of the race, the thought 'I hope he's not doping' was at the back of my mind.

I've just read The Secret Race and I'm now half way through David Millar's book. They both show just how much a part of the sport / lifestyle / culture it was. I suppose as I've only got into cycling in the past year or so, it's difficult to appreciate how much, if anything, has significantly changed since the 90's / early 00's doping scandals.

Contador is one of the biggest names in the game, and we know what happened to him. That was all too recent for the history books...

[mark s]

why do people automatically assume someone is on drugs just because they are a good cyclist or better than anyone else.
unless someone is caught they are clean.

taking drugs and cycling around france for three weeks sounds a great way of spending your summer

[tomtom]

taking drugs and cycling around france for three weeks sounds a great way of spending your summer

:D

[Stubbs]

unless someone is caught they are clean.

Lance never failed a drugs test.

[slackline]

Fairly pointless statistics on Le Tour 

[north_country_boy]

Call me an old cynic but we seem to have a Yellow jersey holder who barely seems to get out of breath whilst riding everyone off his wheel. Where have I seen that before.

Last year...   though to be fair Froome had a few moments where he seemed human - Nibs hasn't so far - maybe he's not been pushed enough. I'm sure someone somewhere is measuring his VO max blah blah and working out pro and against arguments...

I have had exactly the same feelings during the last few stages, and today is no different....

Dominant doesn't really do it justice. Not even a hint of weakness so far in almost three weeks makes it difficult to have no doubts whatsoever...

[Footwork]

yeah +1

The tour is supposed to be a gruelling mess. The weather has been horrid at the start, wet and miserable followed by heat waves. Wonder what the commentators say off mic

[Duma]

Not that I don't share others doubts, but let's be honest, nibs is riding away from the second tier really, the three people I'd expect to give him trouble aren't here. Anyone seriously surprised nibs is significantly better than, eg, bardet?

[Will Hunt]

Exactly. Its reasonable to have doubts when somebody is so clearly streets ahead in the race, but people seem to have forgotten that we're watching a team leader who has won both the Giro and the Vuelta race against a bunch of domestiques and people who were never in a million years expected to make the podium.

If he was losing time or getting dropped by these guys we'd be asking what the hell he was playing at - and probably accusing his rivals of doping for good measure!

If we want to see a proper race next year then just persuade Brailsford and Tinkoff to get Bertie and Froome a set of these:

[tomtom]

OK - so all this implies that there are only 3 or 4 people in the world in the 'elite' group of road cycling - then the rest are just varying shades of domestique? non? Are other sports stratified to such an extent? In athletics for example is there such a top few and the rest are also rans (but also rans by a distance)...?

[webbo]

He has a Manager who was Marco Pantanis back in the day and his Director got banned for drugs/blood doping and is one of the few who has never come clean about it.

[Plattsy]

Thinking about it there is often a dominant athlete in a discipline and sometimes there are great rivalries between 2 or 3 athletes. Can't think of many instances where the winner of a race could come from a group of athletes greater than a handful. Maybe male triathlon at the moment where there are 4 or 5 potential winners depending on the length. e.g. sprint tri's could see a winner from Gomez, Mora, Murray, Brownlees and the Portugese dude who's name escapes me.

Actually having said that the shorter the discipline the greater the number of potential winners. Don't often see a blanket sprint finish in a marathon.

This guy has some views on the performances from this year.
http://sportsscientists.com/

[slackline]

Are other sports stratified to such an extent?

Adam Ondra.

[north_country_boy]

Not that I don't share others doubts, but let's be honest, nibs is riding away from the second tier really, the three people I'd expect to give him trouble aren't here. Anyone seriously surprised nibs is significantly better than, eg, bardet?

Not surprised he has been able to dominate a lot of the field (especially given that the main challengers are relatively inexperienced in Grand Tours), but the way he has dominated Valverde on stages where you would expect Valverde to shine has made Valverde looking distinctly average...

Hopefully Nibali, Froome, Contador and Quintana all ride the Tour next year and we see them all make it through the three weeks to really see how impressive Nibali's form has been this year. He can obviously only respond to what he is faced with and losing Froome and Contador has made it less of the spectacle it promised to be...

[webbo]

Its not that he's riding away from the so called second tier, its that he is doing it barely getting out of breath or breaking in to a sweat.
Yesterday he caught the second guy on the road then attacked so fast it made the other guy look like he was not moving. All on a gradient between 7% and 10% which they were on for 30 mins and not once did he appear to be breathing heavily.
It all looks like the Armstrong days.
Cycling weekly had an article pointing out there is a distinct lack of press questioning around drug use with Nibali compared to the 3 degree that Wiggins and Froome got.

[Will Hunt]

OK - so all this implies that there are only 3 or 4 people in the world in the 'elite' group of road cycling grand tour cycling - then the rest are just varying shades of domestique? non? Are other sports stratified to such an extent? In athletics for example is there such a top few and the rest are also rans (but also rans by a distance)...?

Those same 3 or 4 people will not be so dominant in sprints, time trials (to an extent, unless your name is Bradley Wiggins), single day classics (again to a certain extent) etc

[north_country_boy]

Its not that he's riding away from the so called second tier, its that he is doing it barely getting out of breath or breaking in to a sweat.
Yesterday he caught the second guy on the road then attacked so fast it made the other guy look like he was not moving. All on a gradient between 7% and 10% which they were on for 30 mins and not once did he appear to be breathing heavily.
It all looks like the Armstrong days.
Cycling weekly had an article pointing out there is a distinct lack of press questioning around drug use with Nibali compared to the 3 degree that Wiggins and Froome got.

Very true, he looks so relaxed it raises questions.... however his time up the Hautacam yesterday was only the 27th fastest in tour history....

The media coverage is very strange, however I think teams like Sky and Garmin etc, who have a very clear no doping stance take a lot of the flak sometimes...whereas is reality it should really be the teams who don't come out and make clear statements of intent against doping who should be questioned....Astana are a perfect example, along with Tinkov Saxo.

There have been questions about Nibali's potential associations with Ferrari in the past, so like most riders, he shouldn't be put on a pedestal as squeaky clean just yet...

(for the record I really hope what we are seeing can and should be believed)

[205Chris]

The media coverage is very strange, however I think teams like Sky and Garmin etc, who have a very clear no doping stance take a lot of the flak sometimes...whereas is reality it should really be the teams who don't come out and make clear statements of intent against doping who should be questioned....Astana are a perfect example, along with Tinkov Saxo.

  Tinkoff Saxo have had three stage wins this year without their team leader. Including Micheal Rogers who only last year failed a doping test for clenbuterol later to be cleared following an investigation where he claims he ate contaminated meat.

Excuse sound familiar?