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Tennis Elbow (Read 23615 times)

slackline

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#25 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 17, 2010, 08:36:54 am
Ask a stupid question....

To do the leg work for you as you seem to be unable to use  :google: here are a couple of articles that Scholar returns on the topic of lateral epicondylitis blood flow....

Oskarsson et al (2006) Decreased intramuscular blood flow in patients with lateral epicondylitis. Scandinavian Journal of Medicine & Science in Sports 17:211-215

This seems to start addressing the question as its a prospective study that looked at blood-flow to the region, and it is indeed reduced.

Seveier & Wilson (1999)Treating Lateral Epicondylitis  Sports Medicine 28:375-380

General review of common treatments and how effective they are.


McCarroll (2005)Overuse injuries of the upper extremity in golf Clinics in Sports Medicine 20:469-479

Includes a relevant section on prevention.


It will also be worth keeping an eye on the Cochrane Review of Physiotherapy and physiotherapeutical modalities for lateral epicondylitis its only at the protocol stage at the moment and unfortunately no indication of when the full systematic review will be complete but it will be comprehensive when complete.


Tons of information out there, if you can be bothered to go and find it.

EDIT : The trouble with asking on a forum is that you get anecdotal evidence.  You might get three or four people who say "Yeah, after I started running my sore elbows got better" and then some who have always run who get it anyway, and then loads of people who don't bother responding.  This fails to account for all of the other factors that may be influencing the progression of the affliction in each individual.  Go to the primary literature and find out what has been done in terms of research and form a consensus on that rather than a stranger on the internet.

This is not meant to disparage the excellent knowledge of some posters in this forum, but really, there is a lot of information available on t'net, and I find it exasperating when people don't use it.
« Last Edit: June 17, 2010, 08:57:26 am by slack---line »

gruffalo

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#26 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 17, 2010, 01:24:31 pm
thanks dude there was some interesting information you sorced there 8)

Johnny Brown

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#27 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 17, 2010, 01:31:18 pm
Yeah, he's a wizard on google.

tomtom

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#28 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 07, 2010, 07:02:31 pm
Could do with some help - I get a gentle pain here (where the cross is) above (as in nearer the shoulder) the groove on the inside edge of my outer elbow (if that makes sense). Not IN the grove itself, but about 2 cm up arm from it.. Its generally only after I do pull ups of problems that involve me trying to lock off on the left arm (e.g. Underhand at the Cliff..).. its not bad - and generally just feels a wee bit sore - like an achy muscle - after its been worked hard.
I've looked on the diagrams - and documents posted on this thread and cant really make out what the issue is or where indeed it is!
I manage it by not doing pull ups or things that tweak/hurt it - but I would like to know if there are any exercises that can help it - like some of those on the pdf's here...
Thanks, T


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#29 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 07, 2010, 08:59:22 pm
Are you Popeye?

tomtom

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#30 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 07, 2010, 09:57:53 pm
ug ug ug ug...

sadly not  - and mrsT does not look like Olive Oil..

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#31 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 07, 2010, 11:38:14 pm
Is that the Chinese symbol for "soft" tattooed on your arm, Tomtom?

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#32 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 08:30:23 am
Is that the Chinese symbol for "soft" tattooed on your arm, Tomtom?

 ;D I'm busted... Its a Hull gang tattoo..  It actually means I am a puppy lover who watches soft romantic vampire films CRUSH in a strange inuit/mayan combo hyroglyphic.

I find it hard to understand what bits of elbows/muscles/tendons that people are talking about here (is it my ehcobrachiousarus? or my interiatyranosaurus ligament?) so figured a good old X marks the spot would work. Its actually quite hard to write on your elbow... I'll shut up now. I can see I am digging deeper and deeper...

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#33 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 08:48:44 am
That hard lump just by the cross (i.e. on the inside of your elbow) is your medial epicondyle. It's where a lot of the forearm tendons join the bone.

So, if the pain is near there it could be medial epicondylitits/epicondylosis (golfer's elbow). Unfortunately for you (but fortunately for me) I've never had it so can't offer much help for rehab. (except the classic one - avoid doing things that hurt it!)

Athlon springs to the rescue again: http://www.athlon.com.au/articles/r&i_dodgyelbow.pdf


[usual disclaimer - I actually know nothing, see a specialist]

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#34 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 08:57:17 am
That hard lump just by the cross (i.e. on the inside of your elbow) is your medial epicondyle. It's where a lot of the forearm tendons join the bone.

So, if the pain is near there it could be medial epicondylitits/epicondylosis (golfer's elbow). Unfortunately for you (but fortunately for me) I've never had it so can't offer much help for rehab. (except the classic one - avoid doing things that hurt it!)

[usual disclaimer - I actually know nothing, see a specialist]

Thanks Fultonius, my difficulty in identifying things is that its not on the hard knobbly lump its 2-3 cm further up the arm - past the gap between the two knobbly lumps (if that makes sense!)...

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#35 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 09:17:15 am
Ah, most likely not Medial Epicondylitis then. The Ulnar nerve seems to run through that groove. As far as I'm aware, there aren't any muscles on the upper arm that join the medial epicondyle.

Maybe, as Sausage often suggests, it's referred from the shoulder?  Is it sore to the touch? Swolen? Red?



Or, maybe you're some kind of freak-show with a four-headed triceps brachii  ;) http://www.springerlink.com/content/rj762hv8x80hl034/
« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 09:25:42 am by Fultonius »

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#36 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 09:38:15 am
EDIT : The trouble with asking on a forum is that you get anecdotal evidence...
Go to the primary literature and find out what has been done in terms of research and form a consensus on that rather than a stranger on the internet.
This is not meant to disparage the excellent knowledge of some posters in this forum, but really, there is a lot of information available on t'net, and I find it exasperating when people don't use it.

point taken and i agree about the somewhat pointless nature of the subjective 'evidence' of injury recovery on internet forums. However I would question the value of your average climber reading through RCTs / systematic reviews / papers and trying to form a consdiered opinion on injury prevention or treatment. Having said that some people may be excellent at this, but i feel that the opinion of a qualified professional musculoskeletal physio with an obsessive interest in climbing is probabyl worth quite a lot more. 

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#37 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 09:46:19 am
EDIT : The trouble with asking on a forum is that you get anecdotal evidence...
Go to the primary literature and find out what has been done in terms of research and form a consensus on that rather than a stranger on the internet.
This is not meant to disparage the excellent knowledge of some posters in this forum, but really, there is a lot of information available on t'net, and I find it exasperating when people don't use it.

point taken and i agree about the somewhat pointless nature of the subjective 'evidence' of injury recovery on internet forums. However I would question the value of your average climber reading through RCTs / systematic reviews / papers and trying to form a consdiered opinion on injury prevention or treatment. Having said that some people may be excellent at this, but i feel that the opinion of a qualified professional musculoskeletal physio with an obsessive interest in climbing is probabyl worth quite a lot more.

With the exception of Cochrane Reviews most people won't have access to journal articles unless they pay for them or have institutional access through work so I was perhaps a bit over zealous with regards to the primary literature (although a lot of the older information will be freely available, more recent stuff tends to have restricted access).

But my other point was that there is a lot of information out there on the net and it could be searched through first before posting questions.  When posting saying what you have found out and what you don't understand/aren't clear on and even linking to what you found would be very useful for anyone then trying to answer.

And people posting on forums do so for free and may not have the time inclination to write even if they do have some useful insight, so you may well have to do the searching bit anyway.

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#38 Re: Tennis Elbow
July 08, 2010, 09:52:08 am
I'v got no expertise in this subject which seems to qualify me perfectly to wade in with some pretty much made up advice.

I got pain around there when I was suffering with golfers elbow. Are you sure you're not suffering with this? give the area round that nobbly bone and good hard prod with you thumb is there any tenderness on the nob or around it going down the forearm? I believe fult is right about the ulnar nerve being in that area, perhaps some inflammation in the area from golfers is irritating it? if so the althon article has the answer.

or another... maybe it's a tightness in the neck/shoulder the ulnar nerve starts somewhere around there. Do you have tightness in the neck/shoulder? some stretching around here might help. Try the stretch where hold your arm behind you on a door frame and twist hips to stretch chest. Or here's another. hold arm out at side at right angles to your body and with hand pointing down and palm away from you, inside of elbow should point up. now tilt your head away (still looking forward) from the arm you're holding out (feel stretch in neck and forearm). when I'm particularly tight I can really feel these stretches working the area you've described.

but i've no idea if that's a good thing or not. seek out pro advice.


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#39 Re: Tennis Elbow
September 09, 2010, 01:28:13 pm
I have never had any elbow probs, until the last year. Over the past year I've had a nagging lateral epi niggle , soley on my left elbow that has slowly got worse. It has affected my climbing.

I sadly spend a lot of time using my Iphone, I'm always reading the paper on it, or using www on the bus, checking emails etc. It occured to me that constantly holding my phone out in front of me with my elbow at 90 degrees for a couple of hours a day, could be causing this tendonitis.
Since I have stopped/cut down my iphone addiction, the pain has gone.

I googled it and it seems lateral epicondyilitis and iphones is a well associated link.

I realise I am probaly in a minority of sad people  :( spending all my time on my iphone, but thought I'd share the info in case anyone else had unilateral pain!



http://www.wellsphere.com/massage-spa-article/iphone-elbow/1015005

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#40 Re: Tennis Elbow
November 19, 2014, 12:49:25 pm
Anyone got any experience of using an Epicondyle / Epocondylitis Clasp for tennis elbow? Was suggested by my GP, but not convinced it will make any difference. I've been doing eccentric curls and it seems to be slowly improving.

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#41 Re: Tennis Elbow
November 19, 2014, 10:06:01 pm
I just spoke to a guy down at The Works who was wearing one, he says it's great, just uses it when he's bouldering.

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#42 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 05, 2015, 12:58:03 pm
I am the resurrection.

I've been using a foam roller to ease tension in my forearms, which has helped my tennis elbow a lot.

This was posted on the TC FB page recently which I found quite interesting.

http://theinspiredclimber.com/2014/03/04/a-rock-climbers-elbow-pain/

I'd never heard of trigger point therapy before (even though the label on the roller I'm using says TRIGGERPOINT PERFORMANCE in big letters on it!)

Googling revealed some interesting articles here

https://www.painscience.com/articles/spot-05-forearm-extensors.php

https://www.painscience.com/articles/tennis-elbow.php

http://www.easyvigour.net.nz/fitness/hOBP5_TriggerPoint_Tennis_Elbow.htm

anyway, hope this helps some other sufferers.



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#43 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 10, 2015, 01:38:27 am
Nice to hear you are experiencing some improvement! Like you, a combination of working the knots out of my chronically tight forearms + eccentrics did the trick. One or the other alone wasn't enough

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#44 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 11, 2015, 11:26:23 am
I'm just mildly annoyed that neither me, nor 3 of the different physios I went to figured this out earlier.

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#45 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 11, 2015, 11:38:31 am
With my elbow situation after a few sessions with Kim the osteo in Hathersage the key seems to be A. alleviating the tightness that's built up in forearm/shoulder/back or wherever it is (done by regular stretches, and physio/osteo sessions etc) and B. doing exercises like opposition stuff, rings, wrist curls etc to build up the support in the back and shoulders to prevent the buildup of that tightness in future. This is based on a climber like me who's been climbing for close to 20 years, 15 years of which have been mostly bouldering, and have never really done anything to build up opposition muscles or anything before. Basically in this situation you're almost guaranteed to have a flare up of this kind eventually, unless you never do any steep pulling.

And of course, almost nothing that's caused my elbow flare-up is actually to do with the elbow at all.

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#46 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 11, 2015, 01:48:40 pm
And of course, almost nothing that's caused my elbow flare-up is actually to do with the elbow at all.

exactly

and that's why we need tighter immigration controls and proportional representation

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#47 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 12, 2015, 04:45:21 pm
And of course, almost nothing that's caused my elbow flare-up is actually to do with the elbow at all.

exactly

and that's why we need tighter immigration controls and proportional representation

You forgot the robin hood tax  ;D

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#48 Re: Tennis Elbow
June 19, 2015, 06:17:09 am
i think  had pretty "good" results with magnesium oil sprayed to the forearm, of course i did also stretches,wrist curls,pronators,massage,etc... but it was like week from when i started to try the magnesium oil that the tennis elbow went away. don't know if it really had any help to it or it was just timing.

but there is lot of stuff about magnesium and tendons at google and i decided to try it because at least it cant get any worse by using it

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#49 Re: Tennis Elbow
May 27, 2016, 10:16:28 pm

 

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